Berkeley CSUA MOTD:2004:March:22 Monday <Sunday, Tuesday>
Berkeley CSUA MOTD
2004/3/22 [Uncategorized] UID:12792 Activity:high
3/22    We need a motd awareness infosession. Posts have been bland lately.
        \_ shut the fuck up.  the reason why it's bland is because people
           like you keep censoring it.
2004/3/22 [Politics/Domestic/Election] UID:12793 Activity:high
3/22    Walter Cronkite schools Kerry.,1413,36%257E29003%257E2026871,00.html
        \_ Man, I'm conservitive, but I've still always wondered about
           \_ Those of us who watched Dukakis self-destruct have been
              worried about this for some time.  If only the Dems would
              send John to apprentice under Bill for a while....
2004/3/22-23 [Politics/Foreign/MiddleEast/Israel] UID:12794 Activity:high
3/22    Blow me, MOTD censor dickwit.  I posted a perefctly "legit" link,
        not that it's your job to judge.  As I said, cool shit:   -John
        \_ Blind, paralyzed 67 year old man, confined to a wheelchair,
           assassinated by missles fired from a helicopter. Reason:
           he was a threat to Israel's security.
           \_ Why didn't Israel just arrest him?
              \_ They were trolling the motd.
           \_ Oooh, good troll.  No bites, though, troll harder!
        \_ then why you kept erasing my post?
        \_ John, killing him is not going to solve the problem.  Elimate
           Hamas is not going to resolve the problem.  You do need to carry
           out genocide on Palestinian people, reduce their population to
           insignificant number (similiar to the native American in USA) to
           solve that problem... if you want to solve th problem using
           \_ "The problem" is intractable.  There is no solution that doesn't
              involve the destruction of Israel or moving a few million Arabs
              from Gaza and the WB into other Arab countries that don't want
              the black sheep of Islam.
              \_ Why stop at Gaza and the WB? Why is that going to be enough?
                 There will be no peace for Israel until every living Arab
                 is exterminated.
                 \_ No cookie.  Sorry.  Maybe you'll catch me in a foul mood
                    some other time and I'll feed you then.  I just had a 3
                    hour lunch so you're not getting fed today.
        \_ Wow, for a bunch peace loving people who just want equal rights
           the Palestinians sure were broken up about the death of that
           mass murderer...
           \_ He incited violence.  He didn't murder anyone.  While inciting
              violence is a crime.  It's nothing near being a capital offence.
              The fact that Israel is assassinating people for their political
              ranting shows that neither side has any moral legitimacy in this
              \_ so did Hitler, he just ordered people killed
              \_ That's all fine and dandy in your highly controlled and very
                 law and order western society.  This is a war, not a civil
                 disobedience issue.  Do you think we should send the FBI to
                 arrest bin Laden, too?  Some people are beyond the law
                 especially in places where there is no law.  He was the law.
                 \_ They did arrest him and put him in prison for 8 years.
                    Then they let him go for some reason.  Why did they
                    release him if he's so dangerous?
                    \_ Because Israel is still a law abiding western society
                       and the current 'war' hadn't started yet.  It was a time
                       of relative quiet and the palestinians hadn't stuck the
                       knife in yet.
           \_ Hamas is a social organization that brings food to the poor,
              educates children, provides jobs to the jobless and brings hope
              to the hopeless in a war torn area in a fight the people didn't
              ask for.  The man is a martyr and a victim.  How can you not see
              the good that Hamas does for the people?  The poor guy was in a
              wheel chair?  How could he be responsible for anyone's death?
              This was an unjustified, cowardly act, very unlikely to achieve
              peace in the area and very very bad news for the Middle East
              peace process.  The only way to stop the violence is for the
              Israelis to stop killing Palestinian children, women, and old
              crippled men with their American build missiles and leave *all*
              of the Palestinian territories.  We must go back to the pre-1947
              lines.  Violence only begets violence, so the next time a bunch
              of Israeli teens get killed at a pizza parlor, disco, or a
              university cafeteria by a Palestinian martyr, they should know
              they've brought this upon themselves.  For every Palestinian
              victim of Israeli aggression and illegal occupation there should
              be a thousand Israeli children killed on buses, in school and out
              on the town.  Once the Jews are driven into the sea, there shall
              finally be peace in the Middle East and then we can look to
              bringing the same peace to Europe, starting with France and
                \_ Yassin has stated in several interviews that he supports
                   suicide attacks on Israeli civilians.  Here's one with
                   Die Welt:
           and one with the BBC:
                   \_ It's kinda disturbing when the greatest dreams
                      parents can think of for their children is to
                      become human bombs.
                      \_ Golda Meir, "we will have peace when palestinian
                         mothers love their children more than they hate Jews."
                \_ thanks for illustrating what the attitude problem is.
                   You are blind.  One does not need to build a bomb with
                   his own hands to be responsible for leading others to do
                   the actual work.  You say 'violence begets violence', but
                   yet you do not equally condemn the Palestinians for killing.
                   Almost every cease fire, or peace accord, is broken by yet
                   another suicide bomber, who believes there should be no
                   negotiation, just unilateral withdrawl.  For every one, you
                   claim blood of a thousand.  Where is the equality in that?
                   With that statement, you imply a belief in the superiority
                   of one group over another.  You'd fit well alongside the
                   Nazis. I'm all for a separate Palestinian state, and I
                   dislike a lot of Israel's actions and responses, but I
                   can't say the Palestinians aren't part of the problem
                   \_ I call Godwin's Law on you.
                   \_ Pay attention to the next cease fire. It will probably
                      be broken by an Isreali attack, just like the last one
                      was. Sharon is no more interested in peace than Hamas is.
                      \_ No, pay attention to the past.  Once you see who
                         started the last few years worth of terrorism and
                         upped the ante with suicide bombers you'll start to
                         understand why the Israelis do what they do.  If you
                         were allowed to settle the issue, what would you do?
                         Tell Israel to go back to pre-67 borders?  Close all
                         the check points and give free and open access to the
                         entire country to every Palestinian?
                         \_ On the other hand, Israel has been continously
                            creating new settlements settling Joos from
                            all over the world coming back to Israel on
                            Palestinian land.
                            \_ I disagree with the current settlement policy,
                               however that is not the root cause of the arabs
                               sending their own children into civilian crowds
                               wearing bombs.
                   \_ I'm pretty sure that was satire man.
                      \_ Yeah.  He had me going up until that disco line.
                         \_ disco?  that was the tip off?  so you're unaware
                            of how many Israeli teens were killed in the last
                            2-3 years in Israeli discos? pearls....
                            \_ No, silly boy, the tip off was the part where
                               the author said that Israeli teens getting
                               blown up in discos should realize that they'd
                               brought it upon themselves.  Of course, you'd
                               rather curse the darkness than light a candle,
                               I understand why you jumped to that conclusion.
                      \_ Problem is, there are people who honestly think this
        \_ there was a time when Muslim world are the heaven for Jews who
           are escaping prosecution from Christian church.  I wonder how
           many people remember that.
           \_ was that before or after mass conversions to Islam by the sword?
              \_ after _and_ before.  after the North African conversion by
                 the sword and before the fanatics came to power in Iberia.
                 \_ so the ones who didn't get killed or forced to convert
                    found Islam a haven of open mindedness?  cool.
                    \_ willful child. they mostly emigrated to Islamic
                       kingdoms after the mass conversions and before the
                       rise of the fanatics.  many of them immigrated when the
                       latter came to power.
                       \_ When was this period "before the rise of fanatics"?
                          The whole religion started on day one that way.
                          \_ Nice and glib, but you're completely ignoring the
                             Islamic Renaissance of the late first Milennium.
                             Go visit a place called a "library" and read some
                             interesting things called "books" before posting
                             anything else.
                             \_ Islamic Renaissance? hahaha. they are still
                                living in the dark ages twink
                                \_ Are you trying to look stupid?
                                   \_ No, he's accurate and the truth hurts.
                                      The IR is a period of time they were
                                      advancing faster than Europe in terms of
                                      technology and math but they were still
                                      religious fanatics, primitives, and
                                      incredibly barbaric by our western
                                      standards today.  They never left the
                                      middle ages.  They still whine about
                                      500+ year 'transgressions' by countries
                                      and people that don't even exist anymore.
                                      \_ 500+ years?  That's nothing.  Jews
                                         claim right to a land they left
                                         2000 years ago.
                    \_ I am not sure that "open mindedness" is the right
                       word, but Jews were treated better in the Ottoman
                       Empire than in Christian Europe.
                       \_ The word you are looking for is 'expediency.'
                          The Ottomans knew that tolerance was the only way
                          to run a multi-ethnic, multi-religious, multi-
                          cultural state (which included that haven of
                          tranquility, the Balkans). -- ilyas
                          \_ Is it bad to be tolerant for the sake of
                             expediency?  Is Putin's being tough a stance
                             of principle?
                             \_ I wasn't making a value judgement.  Also,
                                you can't argue with results. -- ilyas
                                \_ how does the ottomans compare
                                   with the russians on their treatment
                                   of jews historically?
                                   \_ The jews were always persecuted in
                                      Russia (Czarist and Communist).
                                      The word 'pogrom' is a Russian word.
                                      Email me for a longer account if you
                                      are interested. -- ilyas
                          \_ they did try to genocide the christian
                             armenians though.
                             \_ Your point is valid, but your use of the word
                                is not.  s/genocide/commit genocide against/
                                \_ I realize that, but I think we should
                                   allow it to be used as a verb or invent
                                   a verb version.  maybe genocize.
                                   ethnically cleanse is awkward,
                                   exterminate is possible but not specific
                                   enough.  "commit genocide against" is
                                   too long, and I am lazy.
                                   \_ You want a verb form of a word made up
                                      to evoke moral outrage and loathing
                                      because the alternatives are too long
                                      and you are lazy?  This truly is the
                                      end of the Roman Empire.
                                      \_ what's the big deal?  this happens
                                         all the time.  eg. "google" is
                                         now used as a verb.
                                         \_ The big deal is that google is not
                                            synonymous with death and misery.
                                            Genocide is.
                                            \_ I don't see the relevancy
                                               of "death and misery" to
                                               the argument.
2004/3/22-23 [Uncategorized] UID:12795 Activity:nil
3/22    A while back someone posted the URL where Ayatollah Ali al-Sistani
        answered a bunch of questions about Shariah.  Does anyone still have
        the URL?
        \_ motd archives?
2004/3/22-23 [Computer/Rants] UID:12796 Activity:nil
3/22    Can someone give me tips on getting in touch with people working at
        local (small-ish) telcos in South/SE/East Asian and Pacific countries?
        Is there some equivalent of NANOG for S. Korea/China/India/
                                    \- yes, BOWMOH [bastard operators with
                                       mandate of heaven]
        Philippines/etc?  Some colleagues in Europe are looking to talk to
        people running regional phone service providers in that general
        area about new business ventures.  -John
        \_ I've got some contacts. If interested drop me an email.
2004/3/22-23 [Computer/SW/WWW/Browsers] UID:12797 Activity:moderate
3/22    Are there any advantages to Netscape over Mozilla -firefox user
        \_ none.
           \_ netscape has integrated AIM, if you like that kind of thing.
              \_ like I said: none.
        \_ If you have to ask...
        \_ Netscape is a discontinued product. -williamc
            \_ since when? netscape 7.1 makes reference to 10.2.x on their
                \_ since the netscape browser division was closed down
                   by aol, dude.
                \_ Netscape 7.1 is based on Mozilla 1.5 and it was the
                   -last- Netscape web browser. Since then, AOL has fired all
                   of Netscape developers (but provided some funding for
                   mozilla project). There will be no more Netscape web browser
                   releases in future. Please don't mention that name here
                   again.  Netscape is dead. It has been for a long time.
                   \_ Long live Mosaic!!!
           \_ "Last week, an AOL spokeswoman said there will be future
              versions of Netscape that are essentially repackaged upgrades
              of Mozilla."  ...that doesn't sound any deader than when they
              started... they're just not putting as much money into it.
        \_ Merc article today about browser alternatives to IE. Langberg pimps
           Opera over Mozilla:
2004/3/22-23 [Uncategorized] UID:12798 Activity:high
3/22    RIP: Brian Maxwell, PowerBar founder, Berkeley alum (1975)
        \_ and donator of cash for the Maxwell Family Field (formerly
           Kleeberger) -tom
        \_ That's just too strange. This guy ran marathons and he died at
           51?! Thank your parents for your genes.
           \_ statistics don't apply well to individuals.  for example,
              suffering heart complications from a viral infection doesn't
              mean you were living an unhealthy lifestyle or belonging
              to a high risk group (at least not a well understood
              high risk group...)
           \_ Maybe he ate too many PowerBars?
        \_ A couple of years ago (maybe the year he sold PowerBar to
           Nestle), he was the largest private donor to Cal.  I think
           he gave $5M.
                \_ ohhh. so that's whata Maxwell Family field is?
                   I was trying to figure it out from the
                   descriptions in the news.
           Nestle), he was the largest single private donor to Cal.
           I think he gave $5M.
2004/3/22-23 [Politics/Foreign/MiddleEast/Iraq, Politics/Foreign/Europe] UID:12799 Activity:kinda low
3/22    The French Connection Kenneth Timmerman reports on
        deep and tight Chirac-Saddam ties.
        \_ Jew
        \_ How about the deep Bush/Laden ties?
           \_ And how about _our_ continued involvement with Hussein
              after the "300,000 of his own people" shit?
2004/3/22-23 [Politics/Foreign/MiddleEast/Iraq] UID:12800 Activity:nil
3/22    Why didn't the Iraqis destroy all the bridges when the
        war started?
        \_ they didn't have any explosives
           \_ what about the explosives tied around their waist?
           \_ they did.  They even put explosives on some of the
              bridges already.
        \_ they need to use the bridges themselves until it's going
           to fall to their enemy, but US is often too fast for
           \_ I think they wanted to get U.S. troops on the bridges
              before they blow it up.  But they should have done it
2004/3/22-23 [Politics/Domestic/911, Politics/Domestic/President/Bush] UID:12801 Activity:kinda low
3/22    All posts critical of the President will be deleted immediately.
        Criticism of our Commander In Chief or the Republican party
        during wartime will no longer be tolerated. -DHS
        \_ so when will the war be over, so that we can resume criticizing
           our CinC?
           \_ Chimp in Charge?
              \_ W00t!!!
           \_ The struggle to preserve freedom will NEVER end!
           \_ War is Peace!  Freedom is Slavery!
        \_ lefty troll.
           \_ You're right. It's not that criticisms of Bush won't be
              tolerated. It's just that you will be deemed anti-American,
              an America hater, pro-terrorist, or a commie.
              \_ Come on, is there an insult more anachronistic than "commie?"
                 You can't even use it ironically, its so tired.  The RPG
                 Paranoia made a joke out of it in 1985.  That was almost 20
                 _years_ ago.
            \_ Why is it a troll? Everytime I put up a post critical of Bush
               or any Republican policies, it is immediately deleted. I
               am just stating the facts.
                \_ facts fuck my ass..
                \_ facts my ass..
2004/3/22-23 [Computer/Networking] UID:12802 Activity:nil
3/22    Is there a host on the net that has every port CLOSED?  I want to
        portscan it to find out which ports my network provider is filtering.
        \_ no. that would be a retarded waste of a machine.
                \_ Or it would be a secure client.
                \_ No, just a interesting use for 1 IP address.
           \_ you can add a hostbased firewall rule that sends a RST
              to any connection from some given ip. --psb
2004/3/22 [Politics/Domestic/Gay] UID:12803 Activity:nil
3/22    Gay marraige, is it inevitable?
        \_ isn't this were the X-men start popping up?
2004/3/22-24 [Consumer/Audio] UID:12804 Activity:low
3/22    ipod or the clones? that is the question? i am looking to get one, the
        ipod 15gb is $299. What clones of comparable price and feature? thx.
        \_ If you look at everyting as "bang-per-buck", then you'd be
           buying Hyundais and living in a ranch in Montana. The question
           you have to ask is "Do I like the way it feels and operates?
           Do I like the user interface?". If you're not going to use
           all 40GB, then disk space isn't the issue.
           \_ This is a fucking mp3 player, not a fucking house. The iPod
              is an overpriced piece of shit. If you're not into gimmicky
              crap and just want a functional mp3 player with enough
              storage at a reasonable price get something like a Nomad Zen
              and save yourself 200 bux and get a couple more hours of
              battery life.
              \_ Most people who buy mp3 players opt for an iPod and
                 most iPod owners are pretty happy with their players.
                 I'm sure you can make the argument about how fucking
                 stupid all those people are but I'm sure most of those
                 people who do get iPods don't really give a rats ass
                 what you think. I used to have an iPod myself until I
                 realized that I'm not much of a music buff but if I
                 ever had to do it again, an iPod would be it. 200 bux?
                 The cheapest iPod is $250 and I wouldn't spend my
                 money on a crappy $50 player.
              \_ News flash: Apple is a FUCKING HARDWARE COMPANY.
              \_ All hail Steve!
                 \_ See above Re: Evans Bathroom.
        \_ I like the iRiver iHP-120 (20 GB for ~$300, only a bit bigger than
           an iPod, good battery life, no desktop software necessary, voice
           recorder, FM tuner).
        \_ the ipod is by no means perfect, but it's the best out there
           in nearly every aspect except for price
        \_ ipod mini. how much music do you have? i've filled my 20gb ipod
           but would have bought the mini if it were available 4 months ago.
        \_ I find it ironic that so many people would spend so much on an
           overpriced dinky hardware toy to store and play back all of their
           stolen music....
           \_ Clever, and dated. Wake up: people do pay for music these days.
              \_ You'd have to be spending a lot on music to fill up 40gb.
        \_ Don't by the Muvo. my coworker had the HD crash on him after 3
           months. I guess it's a common problem. He had a previous product
           from Rio/SonicBlue also crash after <1 year. iPodMini seems to be
           more hip than the original ipod.
2004/3/22-26 [Computer/Companies/Yahoo] UID:12805 Activity:nil
3/22    Yahoo! Search is hiring C++ developers.
        Details in /csua/pub/jobs/yahoo-search.
        Email resumes to   -jdynin

emacs user was here
2004/3/22-23 [Reference/Religion] UID:12806 Activity:moderate
3/22    I know everyone will think this is a troll, but I am genuinely
        curious. Why did the Isrealis assassinate Yasser with a rocket
        when they could have arrested him and put him on trial?
        Only serious answers please.
        \_ more dramatic.  He was already released once from Isreali prison.
        \_ Could have arrested him? How? Do you still remember that an
           Israeli attempt to arrest a bunch of Palestinian militants
           two years ago resulted in a five week stand-off at the
           Church of Nativity in Bethlehem? Or the violent battle that
           took place in Jenin? It's not like Israeli police can just
           drive a police car to his house and arrest him.
           \- well maybe killing palestinians at the rate of 3:1 against
              israelis isnt enough and they want to radicalize things more
              so they can go up to 10:1 or 20:1 or 50:1. you know this is
              the second hamas leader they have killed in the last few months.
              \_ Why do you single out jews?  What's the kill ratio of Hindis
                 vs Muslims in India outside Kashmir, where one can honestly
                 say that the muslims are not the one causing terror?
                 \- because that is what this thread is about. without a
                    doubt there are human rights abuses done by the indian
                    military forces in the valley of kashmir.
                    it is not a hindi [sic] muslim matter but a government
                    vs. rebels. e.g. kps gill who "settled" punjab is a
                    sikh. please delete your irrelevant post and my reply
                    after you read it. --psb
                    \_ oh bullshit, there are plenty of dead muslims inside
                       indias borders killed by both the government and
                       civilians gone into nutty religious frenzies.
              \_ the 2nd?  i thought their recent track record was better than
                 that.  they should send those missile guys out to the range to
                 do some firing practice.  2 in a few months is pathetic.  if
                 they killed off the bastards faster, fewer Israeli and Arab
                 children would die.
                    doubt what happened in gujrat is indefensible. if you
                    want to start a thread on that feel free, but you may
                    want to learn the difference between hindi and hindu,
                    before wading into indian history and politics --psb
2004/3/22-23 [Recreation/Dating, Computer/SW/Languages/Java] UID:12807 Activity:nil
3/22    Femi-Nazis ban urinal: (
2004/3/22-24 [Computer/Companies/Yahoo] UID:12808 Activity:kinda low
3/22    How did sodans get yahoo to not classify mail from csua as spam?
        \_ I called the phone number listed in yahoo's whois record.  after
           waiting on hold for a 10 minutes I got a live person in customer
           care (for paid services) who said to send email to
  too bad Yahoo has no place on their
           website for this sort of contact except for "if you are a bulk
           mailer". BTW, I agree with the youreauseless.. guy.  -op
        \_ Just for a point of possible interest.  Yahoo apparently uses a
           dialup/dsl list and files anything from anyone on that list they
           don't have whitelisted as bulk.  The mail-abuse-bulk address
           should get a response..  --scotsman
        \_ Why do you want to know?
           \_ Because email from my domain and/or my server's IP address
              is getting incorrectly classified as "bulk/spam" by Yahoo's
              \_ And what domain is that, pray tell?  (Thought so.)
                 \_ <DEAD><DEAD>
                    \_ Ah, but you see, my friend, for all we know, traffic
                       from your domain and/or IP is in fact NOT incorrectly
                       classified as spam.  Until you convince us this is not
                       the case you get nothing.
                       \_ Are you a Yahoo?
                       \_ <DEAD><DEAD>.  That's for
                          yahoo to determine.  You're a nobody.  If there's
                          a process or contact or procedure, it shouldn't be
                          some s00per sekte f0r 0nly kewl d00dez leik y00!
                          UR2 kewl 4me <DEAD><DEAD> who I'm sure
                          doesn't know beans about the yahoo process but is
                          instead just another "I hate anonymous motd people"
                          jackoffs which is ironic since you posted anon too.
                          \_ Don't forget your Prozac, darling.
              \_ How much mail are you sending out?
                 \_ To yahoo/sbc: about 5 messages a week.
                    \_ Are you sure you are not infected with one of
                       the zombie spam viruses?
                       \_ Yes, I'm sure. I've contacted yahoo and my
                          network provoder, cause it looks like yahoo is
                          indeed filtering the mail based on IP address.
        \_ I called the phone number listed in yahoo's whois record.  after
           waiting on hold for a 10 minutes I got a live person in customer
           care (for paid services) who said to send email to
  too bad Yahoo has no place on their
           website for this sort of contact except for "if you are a bulk
           mailer". BTW, I agree with the youreauseless.. guy.  -op
        \_ Just for a point of possible interest.  Yahoo apparently uses a
           dialup/dsl list and files anything from anyone on that list they
           don't have whitelisted as bulk.  The mail-abuse-bulk address
           should get a response..  --scotsman
2004/3/22-23 [Computer/Domains] UID:12809 Activity:low
3/22    Is there a place that has the definite rule on domain names?
        I certainly googled and got information that are clearly wrong
        such as .gov can be used by any countries government, or contradictory
        (a domain name can or cannot start with a number).  It does not seem
        to be on or either, surprisingly.
        \_ This is the most political arena on the internet. Read
           these proceedings for a taste of it:
           \_ Does this mean there is no official rule yet??  Just a loose
              set of mutual understanding between different regions and
              operators?  So I might be able to register a domain with some
              oddity at one registrar yet it is unusable globally and outright
              technically illegal in the future?
              \_ It's not "illegal" unless by national laws.  Disputes are
                 handled by WIPO or other arbitration bodies.  -John
              \_ If it is properly registered, it should be usable globally.
                 Hard to say what will happen in the future, though all
                 the registrars tend to have grandfathered in the old
                 stuff, unless some multi-national wants it.
2004/3/22 [Politics/Foreign/MiddleEast/Israel] UID:29875 Activity:nil
3/22    I think they should settle the whole Israel/Palestine conflict via
        professional wrestling.  Each people could have a wrestler
        representative, and all the chair-throwing and piledriver moves would
        satisfy people's lust for violence without anyone actually getting
        hurt.  They could even have the mat set up at the Temple on the Mount!
        \_ I'd like to see a bacon-eating contest.
        \_ but god granted the wrestling ring as holy land.
           "Oi, this guy is meshuggunah..."
2004/3/22 [Politics/Domestic/Crime, Politics/Domestic/President/Bush] UID:29876 Activity:nil
3/22    Why do the Republicans take so much money from the dirty, nasty
        trial lawyers? Why does the motd censor keep deleting this, but
        leaving the pro-Bush posts?
        \_ Dem Constituency: Unions and trial lawyers
           Rep ":  business
           \_ SKY GREEN! SEA YELLOW!
              \_ Soon, baby.
2018/12/16 [General] UID:1000 Activity:popular
Berkeley CSUA MOTD:2004:March:22 Monday <Sunday, Tuesday>