Berkeley CSUA MOTD:2004:January:31 Saturday <Friday, Sunday>
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2004/1/31 [Uncategorized] UID:12044 Activity:nil
1/30    OH MY GOD
        WORST SHOW EVER
        SciFi's CODENAME ETERNITY
2004/1/31 [Politics/Domestic/President/Bush] UID:12045 Activity:nil
1/30  We're going to have to invent a whole new term to describe the Bush
      Administration's spending.  "Like a drunken sailor" doesn't even begin
      to cover it.
      http://csua.org/u/5sa (yahoo news link)
        \_ Since the motd is chock full of conservatives who don't like
           the Bush admin's leftist spending policy, you're baiting your
           hook with the wrong worm.  Care to try again?
           \_ Actually I wasn't trolling.  Were you?  Did you even read
              the link?  Its about money for "Star Wars," a favorite
              conservative pet project.
2004/1/31 [Science/Space] UID:12046 Activity:high
1/30  So to summarize.  The biochemical path taken by developing life was
      swept clean by later, more sophisticated life such that no empirical
      evidence exists for any biochemical path whatsoever.  Moreover,
      scientists don't have a complete, compelling theory, even though they
      are unburdened by ANY possibly falsifying evidence.  Well, I will say
      that support for 'life started on earth' is about as strong as support
      for any other hypothesis, including 'life started on mars', 'life started
      on the moon', 'life was brought here by aliens,' etc.  Keeping in mind
      that mars and moon may have a better preserved record than earth, and
      that aliens may have evolved like scientists think: from chemistry.
        -- ilyas
        \_ the problem with all this stuff is that you can always go one step
           back and say "ok so how did that happen?  what predates that?" all
           the way to the 'beginning' of the universe (if there is such a
           thing) and then you get into, "ok, so how did the universe come
           about?" which leads to various religious concepts or the equally
           oddball stuff coming from physics.
              \_ what oddball stuff are you talking about?
           \_ Yes but you only have to go back a little way before you start
              running into contradictions with religions like Christianity.
              (And no, I'm not talking about stuff like "virgin birth"; aside
              from the biological debate, biblical details such as whether
              someone was a virgin are impossible to verify.)
              \_ A lot of it can be written off as errors in translation and
                 misunderstandings over time.  Even so, if all religions could
                 somehow be proven to be untrue, you still have the same
                 problem with going back and back and back to "how did the
                 universe come into being, from what, and what was 'here'
                 before (wherever 'here' might be in that context?".
      \_ Humans like to think things are magic. Historically they thought things
         from weather to illness were supernaturally controlled. All through
         history, the more we learn about the universe the more we see
         how things result from natural processes. At the limits of observation
         we don't have all the answers, but we can make reasonable conjectures
         that don't involve magical beings. We know a lot of organisms for which
         we have almost no fossil record (e.g. except in amber, which obviously
         only existed in an advanced age). We have some chemical evidence for
         self-replicating processes that could occur.
         Humans also think things are magical when they are improbable. For
         example, when a someone comes out unscathed from a huge disaster.
         But these improbable things too have natural explanations. And it's
         not improbable that the lottery will have a winner.
         But these improbable things too have natural explanations.
         otherwise.  [moved because it made the other replies to op look like
         replies to this which they weren't]
         \_ Argument from history is not enough.  I can also use such an
            argument another way: 'Historically, we could always find some
            intermediate form organism or "living fossil" living in the
            backwoods of the amazon, or some deep sea trench.  Why can't
            we find the lifeform intermediate between a chemical and a
            bacterium?'  Personally, I find the existence of life truly
            puzzling.  Right now we have no answer.  Nor did my alternative
            hypotheses postulate magical beings (or magic of any kind),
            although I don't reject magic either.  I also have problems with
            some feats attributed to evolution, but that's another story.
            I don't see _any_ support for 'life started on earth' at this
            moment.  It's cheaper to assume spores traveled from mars, and
            hope mars has something illuminating in the rocks, than to assume
            carbon and hydrogen combined to form a replicating machine
            involving three separate components (each a giant molecule), none
            of which can function without the other two.
              -- ilyas
            \_ How so? How is it cheaper to assume spores traveling from Mars
               than a primordial soup of amino acids getting a spark from
               the nascent Earth atmosphere? In the first case you still need
               to explain where the spores came from, and then explain how
               it is they happen to be capable of surviving the journey from
               Mars, not to mention what force caused them to suddenly
               migrate to Earth at just the right moment to get sucked into
               the Earth's orbit rather than the much more likely scenario of
               the spores missing Earth completely and ending up in the Sun.
               If you're willing to assume that many coincidences, why not
               believe that the elements on Earth just happened to fuse in the
               right way to form the essential amino acids that form the basis
               for life?
               \_ Because there are lots of spores, and they can survive the
                  trip (spores from bacteria on earth routinely go off into
                  outer space, they are found at all layers of the atmosphere).
                  Also, because it's more likely life arose on Mars, given a
                  good fossil record on Mars (which may or may not exist --
                  we don't know, but we can't rule it out), and traveled to
                  earth than it arose on earth, given no record before bacteria
                  at all.  The missing variable here is whether there is
                  some location 'close by' where a good record exists.  In my
                  mind the probability for something like that shoots up, if
                  there is nothing here on our rock.  I don't buy the argument
                  that every single trace of pre-bacterial life simply
                  disappeared.  It just never happened at any other stage of
                  life.  -- ilyas
                  \_ 1) So because it never happened at any other stage of
                     life, _so far as we know_, it's unlikely to have
                     happened?  2) We have possible traces of pre-bacterial
                     life in the structure of our own cells and in our DNA.
                     3) If we find that fossil record on Mars or the Moon,
                     then I will certainly give your theory more credence;
                     until then, the idea that multi-cellular life is the
                     result of random molecules bonding and that subsequent
                     iterations of such life wiped out the traces or our
                     equipment is still too insensitive to detect the evidence
                     sounds much more likely. I don't expect to convince you,
                     but I do want you to understand why some of us disagree
                     with you.
         \_ humans like to think probable things are improbable, due to
            inappropriate assumption of (combinatorial) conditions that
            are really independent...
         Bottom line, there is more support for "life started on earth" than
         otherwise.
        \_ ok...so?
        \_ the problem with all this stuff is that you can always go one step
           back and say "ok so how did that happen?  what predates that?" all
           the way to the 'beginning' of the universe (if there is such a
           thing) and then you get into, "ok, so how did the universe come
           about?" which leads to various religious concepts or the equally
           oddball stuff coming from physics.
           \_ Yes but you only have to go back a little way before you start
              running into contradictions with religions like Christianity.
2004/1/31-2/1 [Computer/SW/SpamAssassin] UID:12047 Activity:nil
1/30  So, if i'm using spamassassin -p /my/prefs/file and want to change to
      spamc, can I?  I maned spamc and didn't see a analogous flag.
        \_ Currently, you can't; the protocol spamc uses to talk to spamd
           doesn't include any way to specify which prefs file to use.
           This wouldn't be too hard to add, though, if you think it would
           be useful -- let me know.  --mconst
2004/1/31-2/1 [Computer/SW/SpamAssassin] UID:12048 Activity:nil
1/30  Has anyone else been getting these creepy messages/spams from Word
      Of Mouth Connection?  They say "someone is requesting information on
      you," but in order to find out who, you have to pay money.  Seems like
      a total scam, and a seemingly very effective one as it plays on your
      natural paranoia.
      \_ sounds just like the secret crush/admirer spam.
      \_ Yes.  And I've blocked about 12 of their domains so far.  It's just
         spam shit.  Here's my sendmail access file so the rest of you can
         avoid adding them one at a time:
      \_ http://www.choam.org/tbp/weblog/2003/11/26/000132

womc.info       REJECT
http://womc.net        REJECT
http://womc.com        REJECT
wordofmouthconnection.info      REJECT
<DEAD>wordofmouthconnection.net<DEAD>       REJECT
http://wordofmouthconnection.com       REJECT
wordofmouthreports.info         REJECT
<DEAD>wordofmouthreports.com<DEAD>          REJECT
<DEAD>wordofmouthreports.net<DEAD>          REJECT
<DEAD>wordofmouthconnections.org<DEAD>      REJECT
<DEAD>wordofmouthconnections.com<DEAD>      REJECT
http://wordofmouthconnections.net      REJECT
<DEAD>wominfo.net<DEAD>     REJECT
<DEAD>wominfo.org<DEAD>     REJECT
<DEAD>wominfo.com<DEAD>     REJECT
2004/1/31 [Uncategorized] UID:12049 Activity:nil
1/31    Little Jeremiah should be returned to his mother.  This is just
        another case of the government trying to dstroy the African-American
        community and ruin a young woman's reputation and dishonor her
        special status as a mother.  http://www.ohio.com/mld/ohio/7832835.htm
2004/1/31-2/1 [Computer/SW] UID:12050 Activity:nil
1/31    /csua/pub/jobs/software.architect
        Snapfish is looking for very senior software person to do what you'd
        expect from very senior software people.  Snapfish HR likes good cover
        letters, so send one if you have one.  I can answer questions about
        the company and most questions about the position.  I'm posting this
        as a favor to HR so you can use my name in your cover.  --reiffin
        \_ If anyone wants some real-world input on the interview process
           with this company feel free to drop me an email --williamc
2004/1/31-2/1 [Uncategorized] UID:12051 Activity:very high
1/31    What do you do on weekend afternoons?
        \_ troll the motd
           \_ we aren't doing such a good job now, are we.
              \_ got you to reply.
              \_ yermomma's so dumb, she burned down the house with the
                 CD burner!
                 \_ that's not serious and political enough to be funny.
                    (Boondocks reference noted.)
        \_ Work on my no-doubt-overvalued Bay Area home.
2004/1/31-2/1 [Uncategorized] UID:12052 Activity:nil
1/31    New, improved Trek:
        http://mtrek.game-host.org
2004/1/31-2/1 [Science/GlobalWarming] UID:12053 Activity:high
1/31    Motd poll!
        World revolves around motd: .
        Motd revolves around world:
        \_ world?  what is this "world" of which you speak?  there is
           something outside the motd?  the world is larger than 80x24?
           URL, please.  you have no proof of this at all.
           \_ the world was, for a moment, larger than 80x24, but then
              was quickly reformatted
              \_ thank god, now it's all coming into clearer focus.
2004/1/31-2/1 [Uncategorized] UID:12054 Activity:nil
1/31    http://www.kaicurry.com/gwbush/remindus.swf
2004/1/31-2/1 [Reference/Tax] UID:12055 Activity:nil
1/31    Is the economy picking up? 4 job postings on the motd. Not quite 1998,
        but not bad either.
        \_ i was thinking the same thing.  of course, i've been hearing
           talking heads and economists say shit about economic recovery,
           but until job postings on the motd picked up i have to admit
           i didn't believe it.  I guess this relates to the above poll.
        \_ This despite Bush's tax cuts oppressing the poor!
           \_ No really, are you an idiot? [restored]
              \_ OMG!  WTF!  LOL!  No.  Are you?
        \_ because if they didn't hire the rest of us would just keel over and
           die and then they'd have to hire and have no one to train the new
           people.  having a job has been nice but it isn't 1998 nice.
        \_ Amazing it took this long considering how much money is being pumped
           into the economy via tax cuts and big federal spending increases.
           I guess it takes a long time to "trickle down" from defense
           contracts.
           \_ Bush' claim to fame is that this is one of the shortest
              recessions ever. nice troll though.
              \_ Actually neither are true.  The recession started during the
                 Clinton admin. and the official length of time is about the
                 same as any other since these things were tracked.  And no,
                 it wasn't a very good troll, just standard lefty noise.  As
                 a middile class person who got a useful amount of money back
                 on my taxes, I'd be really fucking pissed off if all those
                 "tax cuts for the rich!" got rolled back.
                 \_ See, that's funny, because I'm a "middle class person"
                    likely in the same upper five figure income bracket as
                    the rest of you, despite what Mr. I'm A Big Adult
                    seems to think.  And I got a whole $40 a month extra
                    out the tax cut.  Is that what you call a "useful amount
                    of money?"  Its half a good pair of pants!  Or a halfway
                    decent meal out!
           \_ It was a one time boost. Already the economy is starting
              to turn back down.
              \_ nothing goes straight up or straight down.  when it was going
                 down there were plenty of 'ups' along the way.
           \_ Uhm, a lot of us haven't gotten our first full refund yet.  If
              you earned a pay check you'd know that.  Come back when you're
              taller.  Thanks for joining us for today's grown-up topic.  The
              kids' topic for tomorrow is "pokemon or yu-gi-oh, which is right
              for you?"
              \_ Hey look, its Mr. I'm A Big Adult!  You're my favorite motd
                 asshole.  Seriously, you need a new line.
                 \_ When the kids leave, I'll stop using it.  I think Pokemon
                    is more your speed.  Would you disagree?  Are you more of
                    a Yu-gi-oh kid?
                    \_ Keep on trollin'...
                       \_ So you're a "Heart Of the Cards!" guy, huh?
                          \_ I think he's a Pokemon guy.
        \_ There was an article in the paper (either Chronicle or WSJ) that
           mentioned that there was this guy that either turns around your
           company or liquidates it. He moved from San Diego to Silly Valley
           because there is lots of liquidation business...and this was very
           recent. The big tech turnaround hasn't happened yet, and probably
           won't until the next big innovation happens. There are still too
           many ppl looking for too few jobs. If you don't have the skill set,
           experience, exceptional talent, and/or bow to a company's every
           wish, expect to be out of circulation for quite some time.
           \_ I read that article.  It was just his high hopes and free
              advertising.  He moved here years ago, not recently and it was
              from LA, not SD.
           many ppl looking for too few jobs.
2004/1/31-2/1 [ERROR, uid:12056, category id '18005#15.2865' has no name! , ] UID:12056 Activity:nil 72%like:29775
1/31    I guess Dean was the better candidate afterall....
        http://tinyurl.com/2l8kh (signonsandiego)
        \_ Direct URL:
           http://www.signonsandiego.com/news/politics/20040130-9999_1n30kerry.html
2004/1/31 [Computer/SW/Virus] UID:29773 Activity:nil
1/30    Someone asked how computer viruses are named?
        http://www.wildlist.org/naming.htm
2004/1/31 [Computer/SW/Unix] UID:29774 Activity:nil
1/30  Um, so, if I do "find . -type f -exec grep -i port {} \;" I don't
      get the file name. How do I make it print file name?
      \_ -print?
      \_ find . -type f | xargs grep -i port
              \_ doesn't work if path contains space
                 \_ if your path contains spaces then you need to go shoot
                    yourself and whatever moronic user put spaces in a path.
           \_ find . -type f -print0 | xargs -0 grep -iH port
            (if you've got gnu find and xargs) --dbushong
2004/1/31 [Politics/Domestic/Election] UID:29775 Activity:nil 72%like:12056
1/31    http://signonsandiego.printthis.clickability.com/pt/cpt?action=cpt&title=SignOnSanDiego.com+%3E+News+%3E+Politics+--+Kerry+no+stranger+to+lobbyists%27+donations&expire=&urlID=9116821&fb=Y&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.signonsandiego.com%2Fnews%2Fpolitics%2F20040130-9999_1n30kerry.html&partnerID=621
        I guess Dean was the better candidate afterall....
        \_ Direct URL:
           http://www.signonsandiego.com/news/politics/20040130-9999_1n30kerry.html
2017/09/23 [General] UID:1000 Activity:popular
9/23    
Berkeley CSUA MOTD:2004:January:31 Saturday <Friday, Sunday>