Berkeley CSUA MOTD:2003:December:02 Tuesday <Monday, Wednesday>
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2003/12/2 [Politics/Domestic/Gay, Politics/Domestic/California/Arnold, Politics/Domestic/President/Bush] UID:11268 Activity:nil
12/1    Donald Rumsfeld wins Foot In Mouth Award:
        http://www.plainenglish.co.uk/footinmouth.html
        \_ "I believe that gay marriage should be between a
            man and a woman." - Arnold Schwarzenegger
        \_ George Orwell, "Politics and the English Language," 1946:
           http://www.resort.com/~prime8/Orwell/patee.html
        \_ Which is bizarre, because his quote makes perfect sense.
           \_ It's a logical tautology:
              Things we know we don't know = Everything - Things we know
              In a logical sense, he's saying we are aware of fewer ignorances
              than we have, which would not be the case if we knew everything
              we know, got it? ;-)
              \_ You must not see some of the questions he gets from reporters.
                 Sometimes he has to talk real slow, with short words.
              \_ Bzzzt.  Things we know we know.
                         Things we don't know that we know.
                         Things we know we don't know.
                         Things we don't know that we don't know.
           \_ I knew someone would say this.  Typical computer people.  Just
              because it makes logical sense, doesn't mean that its clear
              English.  Its very deserving of the award, which is meant to
              encourage clear public speaking.  I bet you think Stroustrup is
              a well written piece of literature.
              \_ Okay, so what was not clear about it? I fully understood the
                 intent of the statement the first time I read it with little
                 difficultly.
                 \_ Forest.  Trees.  Try the Orwell article, it might make
                    things a teensy bit more clear to you.
                    \_ Non. Sequitor. I read the Orwell article. Did you?
                       There's nothing like that at all in what Rumsfeld said.
                       The only thing I see at all that MAY confuse someone is
                       that the words "unknown" and "known" are used many times
              \_ I'd like to see a transcript of the whole interview.  He
                 sometimes says inane things to point out the inanity of the
                 questions he gets.
                 \_ Oh I see, so sounding inarticulate is like a Jedi Mind
                    Trick?
                    \_ No it's more like: "look you dumb asses, maybe if I talk
                       to you like you're a 3-year-old you'll understand"
                       \_ So wait.  I have to be a 3 year old to understand
                          what Rummy is saying here?  Are you a 3 year old?
                          \_ Bush Good, Saddam Bad.
                             America Strong, Terrorists Weak.
                          \_ No you moron.  It makes perfect sense, but normally
                             you wouldn't be so verbose in pointing it out.  I'd
                             like to see the transcript because it's most likely
                             he already answered the question several times and
                             was spelling out the obvious when it was clear that
                             the reporters were idiots.
2003/12/2 [Uncategorized] UID:11269 Activity:nil
12/1    so, who's going to the Insight Bowl?
          \_ Tedford and the Football team.
2003/12/2 [Politics/Domestic/California, Recreation/Dating] UID:11270 Activity:kinda low
12/1    I understand why marrying one's sibling would be illegal. But how about
        consensual sex between two adults who happens to be siblings?  Why
        should that be illegal?  Government has no right to dictate what
        should or shouldn't happen between two consenting adults.
        \_ you can have children whether or not you're married.
        \_ In a family, just because you're over 18 doesn't mean you have full
           autonomy.  If it truly is consensual, the only reason for it to be
           illegal is the increased likelyhood of having handicapped kids.
           \_ Shouldn't there be a minimum genetic distant between two
              people before they are allowed to marry? Not just siblings but
              cousins shouldn't be allowed nor should uncle/niece.
              \_ There was a study showing that occasional marriage between
                 first cousins has a minimal effect on birth defect rates.
                 There was only a problem when it is commonplace to marry
                 your cousin.
                 \_ I would die for you Saddam, and the right to marry a
                    first cousin!
           \_ That's a weird reason. By that logic, it should be illegal for
              older women to have sex. After all, they have an increased
              likelyhood of having handicapped kids.
              \_ There were a number of eugenics laws in this country in the
                 early 20th century.  I'm not saying it's fair, but society
                 frequently bans things it frowns upon.
                \_ http://csua.org/u/54q     California Eugenics history
        \_ I belive FDR married his 2nd cousin.  And marrying one's cousin is
           legal in CA.  It's a state law, not a federal law.
        \_ Didn't Einstein marry his first cousin?  Did they have any
           kids?  Were they nearly as smart as the dad?
           \- TACO: Einstein's older son used to teach at Berkeley.
           \- IAOC: Einstein's older son used to teach at Berkeley.
                    The younger had some kind of brain problem and died
                    young, I believe. --psb
              \_ TACO?
                    young, I believe. --psb
              \_ IAOC?
               \_ THAC0
2003/12/2 [Academia/GradSchool] UID:11271 Activity:kinda low
12/2    Grad school is cool. I play games and watch a lot of TV and meet a
        lot of people and I'm really enjoying it. But before you go there you
        gotta ask yourself whether you want to make financial sacrifices.
        For example, can you live on Burger King/speghetti all over again?
        Do you want to live in Berkeley-like apartments again? Can you live
        without traveling (funny rule of thumb, work=lots of money/no time
        to travel, school=lots of time to travel/no money). Can you spouse/
        gf/family live without your support? It's a lot of sacrafice. I'm
        still trying to figure out whether it's worth it or not. In the
        mean time, I've decided to take a huge loan. Heck the interest rate
        is low and I don't have to pay as long as I'm a student.  -ucla stude
        \_ With English like that, how the heck did you make the cut into
           graduate school?
        \_ different programs are different.  i'm required to travel quite a
           bit as a grad student, and have been able to pay off about
           half of my undergrad debt on my grad student stipend.  And I
           don't live on junk food.  I also work(in the lab) 60-80 hrs/wk.
           -physics grad student
2003/12/2 [Academia/Berkeley/CSUA/Motd, Academia/Berkeley/CSUA/Troll] UID:11276 Activity:nil
12/1   if you only have a third of a thread archived, don't even bother.
       censorship sucks, but so does reading old, fractured threads.
        \_ i bet you are the one who censored the thread at first place.
           \_ that is a bet you would loose.
                                      \_ lose
              \_ Ob so is yermom
                 \_ You overwriting bastard.  I'll bet your overwriting
                    is the cause of the motd being deleted in the first
                    place.
                    \_ Yes I overwrote but at least I was using me, unlike
                       you.  --sky
                       \_ Get a clue, sky.  Using motdedit does not excuse
                          you from acting like a decent human being and not
                          overwriting other people's posts.  Learn to copy
                          and paste, and learn a little patience. --erikred
                          \_ There's no excuse not to use me... Be a decent
                             human being and use me.  --sky
                             \_ Use me, baby.
2003/12/2 [Recreation/Music] UID:11277 Activity:nil
12/2    I watched a documentary on ME109s vs. Spitfires and whenever they
        talked about the ME109s, Beethoven's music started to play. So does
        this mean Beethoven's music was loved by the Nazis?
2003/12/2 [Recreation/Dating] UID:11278 Activity:nil
12/2    Why do Sodans love to talk about hot gay sex so much?
        \_ Fashionable.  PC.
2003/12/2 [Computer/Companies/Yahoo, Politics] UID:11279 Activity:nil
12/2    Yahoo! News - Serious Linux Security Flaw Found
        http://csua.org/u/54t
        Must be the best moment for Gates.
2003/12/2 [Health/Disease/General] UID:11280 Activity:nil
12/2    Why is homosexual generally looked down upon? I think it is the
        perfect solution to our over-crowded planet. Promiscuous homos do not
        produce children, and the disease they spread will keep down
        population. Just as monasteries were invented in China to keep
        males happy (female babies were killed consistently), homosexuality
        is just as effective, and is a much more humane solution than
        Mein Kampft.
        \_ Personally, I don't look down on homosexuals at all.  I
           like to save up my contempt and hatred for numbnuts morons
           who post to the motd without bothering to learn English.
2003/12/2 [Uncategorized] UID:11281 Activity:nil
12/2    What does "miserable failure" mean?  Oh wait... I know...
        I'll just google for the answer.
2003/12/2 [Politics/Domestic/Gay] UID:11282 Activity:nil
12/2    Gay Recap:
        Liberal: As long as it's consensual, let me do what I want to do,
        it's my choice if I want to corrode the moral fabric of our society.
        Conservative: Gay sex is on par with polygamy, incest, and bestiality.
        \_ Christian: how do pin angels on the Christmas tree?
           Satan:     how to stick a pin through angels?
           Atheist:   how come there are so many pinheads in this world?
        \_ How nice, a Fair And Balanced (TM) summary.
           \_ It was ruled that the Fox Trademark "Fair and Balanced" was
              unenforceable when throwing out their inane suit against the
              Al Franken book "LIES and the Lying Liars who tell them, a
              Fair and Balanced look at the Right"
              \_ He didn't rule that it was unenforceable, just unenforceable
                 in that instance.
        \_ Being gay is not a choice.
           \_ But having sex is.
              \_ Do you accept that being gay is not a choice?
                 Just want to make sure.
                 \_ What I accept is that there is a spectrum of sexual
                    attraction, and that it appears in most cases there is
                    little or no choice involved in attraction.  However, I have
                    seen anecdotal evidence to the contrary--men who lived
                    promiscuous homosexual lives who then married women and
                    lived happy lives (likely they were somewhere in the middle
                    of the sexual attraction spectrum).  I also knew someone who
                    viewed a *lot* of pornography went from straight porn to gay
                    porn and suddenly "discovered" that he was bisexual.
        \_ And at least one lawyer is arguing it:
           link:csua.org/u/54r
        \_ wow, way to make both sides look bad.
           \_ that was my goal, i feared that i was bashing one side more than
                the other. --'some of my best friends are gay'
                \_ dude, being gay is not a choice
                   \_ neither are psychopathic tendencies
                      \_ only a motd person could equate love with psychosis.
                         \_ The man makes a point.  Why is homosexuality not a
                            disease?  It is certainly not normal, regardless of
                            whether it's a behavioral or a genetic condition.
                            It's certainly debilitating (it results in effective
                            sterility in most animals).  Humans find ways around
                            it, but they find ways around blindness too.  Blind
                            people don't drive cars.
                            \_ Are you against the use of birth control?  Do
                               you believe propogation of our species is the
                               point of sex?  I'm talking about human society,
                               not biological precepts.
                               \_ No I don't believe that to be the point of
                                  sex.  However, inability to procreate
                                  conventionally is certainly a debilitating
                                  effect, would you not agree?
                                  \_ Er, no.  As people have searched over
                                     the multitude of millenia for ways to
                                     prevent pregnancy, i most certainly do
                                     not agree.
                                     \_ More common is regulating pregnancy, not
                                        avoiding it entirely.
                               \_ What relevance does this have? --not the
                                  person asked the question
                                  \_ Drawing a parallel to illustrate the
                                     fallacy of the argument?
                                     \_ Drawing a fallacial parallel won't
                                        illustrate a thing about the argument.
                            \_ Indeed, it was listed as a mental disorder by the
                               APA, but was removed from the list without
                               review.
                            \_ http://www.sissify.com/juice/dsm4.html#orient
                               If you want the other side, visit http://narth.com
                               \_ But why did homosexuals fight to have this
                                  classification removed?  You can mount much
                                  more effective lobbying if you, as a group,
                                  are considered to have a disease.  You can
                                  tug at more heartstrings that way.  Look at
                                  the blind and the deaf.
                                  \_ Probably because classifying it as
                                     a disorder is incorrect.
                                     \_ Ah, but why without review?  Was it
                                        determined to be incorrect based on
                                        scientific grounds?  Or on PC grounds?
                         \_ The point is that tendencies are often not choices,
                            but actions are.  Alcoholics are alcoholics whether
                            they drink or not.
2003/12/2 [Uncategorized] UID:29685 Activity:nil
12/1    Are non-jews allowed to use the term jap?
        \_ the Jewish term is JAP.
2003/12/2 [Uncategorized] UID:29686 Activity:nil
12/1    When was the last time you skipped?
        \_ about a week.  seeing extended family gave me less cause to
           skip then work before stupid "vacation."
        \_ skipped what?
           \_ Um... skipped.  instead of walking...
        \_ Couple of weeks ago.  You need to feed me a lot of coffee...
2003/12/2 [Uncategorized] UID:29687 Activity:nil
12/1    How can I play Griljor?
2017/09/20 [General] UID:1000 Activity:popular
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Berkeley CSUA MOTD:2003:December:02 Tuesday <Monday, Wednesday>