Berkeley CSUA MOTD:2003:November:18 Tuesday <Monday, Wednesday>
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2003/11/18 [Computer/SW/Unix] UID:11113 Activity:kinda low
11/17   ./ Agent Gates: I hate this place. This GNU. This open source.
        This license, whatever you want to call it. I can't stand it
        any longer. It's the free software, if there is such a thing.
        I feel saturated by it. I can taste your GPL. And every time
        I do, I fear that I've somehow been infected by it.
        \_ Mr. Torvalds: My name ... is Linus.
        \_ ./, huh?  What is this dotslash of which you speak?
2003/11/18 [Politics/Domestic/President/Bush] UID:11114 Activity:kinda low
11/17   http://csua.org/u/50w
        "The Idiot's Guide to Great Britain". This is hilarious.
        \_ i don't think it's funny.  and i really hate bush.
                \_ just out of curiousity, do you personally know of anyone
                   who likes Bush, supports his policies, and want him to
                   be re-elected again? I know many many people and I don't
                   know of anyone who likes him. Maybe it's a California
                   thing or something but I'm just curious.
                   \_ He lost CA in 2000 by a few percent.  It isn't Bush, it
                      is the people you know.  When you're a carpenter and you
                      hang out with other carpenters and don't do anything but
                      work wood and go to carpenter meetings, you'll think
                      everyone is a carpenter even though you know many many
                      carpenters.
                      \_ 12 is more than "a few." Bush only got 41% statewide.
                         But is it probably more a matter of which county you
                         are in. In Alameda County Bush got 24%, in SF even
                         less.
                         \_ I didn't have the numbers handy.  12.  That's fine.
                            With 41% that means 4 of your 10 friends should be
                            Bush supporters.  If all your friends are in
                            Alameda then 1 in 4 should be.  You're a carpenter.
                            It's ok.  Just keep going to the carpenter union
                            meetings and working wood.  Or maybe your
                            \_ Huh huh. You told him to keep working wood.
                               - Butthead
                            conservative friends don't tell you because they
                            don't want to hear you go off on how stupid/evil/
                            whatever Bush is because politics can kill friend-
                            ships and they value your friendship more than your
                            politics.  I gently and politely correct my leftist
                            friends when they start frothing but they all think
                            I'm a socialist just like them.  I don't want to
                            lose them as friends even if they're confused and
                            ignorant about the world in some ways.
        \_ Concept: 8.5 / Execution: 2
        \_ Pretty second-rate humor.  -John
        \_ If you're going to make a top-ten list, the number one rule is:
                BE FUNNY!
           This isn't.  Concept: 3.0 because it's so done.  Execution: 1 only
           because he actually gets #9 correct and #3 is so-so for those who
           give a shit about "The Royals".
2003/11/18 [Politics/Domestic/California, Computer/SW/OS/Windows] UID:11115 Activity:nil
11/17   I just got MS California Standard Claim Form. I can list up to 5
        purchases without a proof of purchase. I can get $29 for Office,
        $5 for Word, $26 for Excel, $16 for Windows. What are the best
        combinations to put down?
        \_ umm, dude. do you have any recollection of something called
           basic arithmetic? and if you mean the best combination to lie
           about to prevent being caught (or some other weird shit),
           how the fuck should we know?
        \_ write to atterney general telling them that you prefer spend
           money on something else other than Microsoft product.  The
           current term of settlement is nothing more than another
           Microsoft's ploy to increase its buttom line.
           \_ uh, you get vouchers good for whatever software and a
              fairly liberal range of hardware, not just microsoft stuff.
        \_ I just got another claim form even though I already sent in
           mine weeks ago.  Looking forward to get $70+.  Incredibly,
           I still have all the receipts even though they are not
           required.
        \_ I didn't read the paper one but the online one said proof of
           purchase was required?
2003/11/18 [Computer/HW/CPU, Computer/SW/OS/FreeBSD] UID:11116 Activity:nil
11/17   I'm looking to buy a UPS for use with my Open/FreeBSD x86 systems at
        home. Something in the 500 va to 750 va range is enough for me. I
        just need enough power for 10 mins or so (enough time to shutdown
        both boxes). Any recommendations on specific models? (I'm willing to
        spend upto about $200). tia.
        \_ Slickdeals has a UPS for about $30.  http://slickdeals.net
        \_ you looking for something with net/serial manageability, so your
           x86 system can know to shut itself down before the power goes out?
           \_ Yes. I want to use something like nut or apcupsd (or anything
              else that might be better) in order to shutdown my systems
              when the power goes out for longer than 1 min or so.
2003/11/18 [Computer/SW/Unix] UID:11118 Activity:nil
11/18   Does anyone know the circumstances under which rsync will fail to
        update a file that has differences (besides the obvious ones, like
        with --size-only or whatever)? I used a command line like
        'rsync -Pv host:foo .' where my cwd has a file 'foo', which is
        ~300 MB, but rsync failed to update it. Granted, it was the same
        size and probably had the same timestamp, but it was definitely
        different. I ended up forcing rsync to update by using -c, but I
        thought I shouldn't need anything like that. Thanks for any insight.
        \_ use the source, luke!
        \_ do you have write permission on the file?
           \_ yes, -c (always checksum) worked, but as the rsync manual says
              is kinda slow.
              \_ this has to be a troll, but... how do you expect rsync to
                 tell the difference if the size and timestamp are
                 identical w/o doing a checksum or worse?
2003/11/18 [Computer/SW/SpamAssassin] UID:11119 Activity:high
11/18   Can someone recommend a good place to get started on procmail and
        SpamAssassin?  I forward my soda mail to another account, which avoids
        the (very effective) blacklists on that machine.  I'd like to send it
        through SpamAssassin before it gets forwarded.  -John
        \_ motd log or what I do:
        :0fw
        | /usr/local/bin/spamc

        X-Spam-Status: Yes
        gets set if the message is spam. you can then do something like:
        :0 hw:
        * ^X-Spam-Status: Yes
        spamassassin
        \_ The spamassassin docs say how to do set it up with procmail.
        \_ Just curious, anyone tried using both ifile and spamassassin?
           \_ Yes, but it was hard to get it through both filters.  If you run
              ifile first, SpamAssassin will overwrite the X-Ifile spam header
              and make the message an attachment.  If you do SpamAssassin
              first, ifile will "learn" from SA's X-Spam-Status header, which
              is bad.
              and make the message an attachment.  If you do SpamAssassin first,
              \_ Can you get ifile is ignore that header?  --sa user
                 \_ Possibly, but then you're still running ifile on a post-SA
                    piece of spam-- SA removes all headers except for To, From,
                    Date, & Subject, then attach-ifies the rest (last time I
                                       \_ isn't that a SA option? (user_prefs)
                                          \_ indeedy do.  Thanks.
                    checked), so ifile will start to pick up on that sort of
                    pattern.  OTOH, since ifile is only looking for words and
              ifile will "learn" from SA's X-Spam-Status header, which is bad.
              \_ Can you get ifile is ignore that header?  --sa user
        \_ man spam
                    not format, this might not be a huge issue.
        \_ anyone have a local install of spamassassin 2.60?
           \_ Yeah in ~abuser/trojans/hehehe/spamassassin/bin/
        \_ man spam
2003/11/18 [Politics/Foreign/MiddleEast/Israel] UID:11120 Activity:nil
11/18   http://csua.org/u/50z
        All praise the religion of peace!
        \_ It's Israel's fault.  Says so right in the article.
2003/11/18 [Politics/Domestic/Gay] UID:11121 Activity:nil
11/18   http://apnews.myway.com/article/20031118/D7UT3KPG0.html
        Why do so many gay women look like men in skirts?  Check out
        Gina & Heidi in this gay marriage ban article.
2003/11/18-19 [Recreation/Humor, Academia/Berkeley/CSUA/Motd] UID:11122 Activity:nil
11/18   Attention Anonymous Motd Comic!  Have you been working the motd
        lately?  I haven't seen anything funny in the last couple of weeks.
        Thanks.  -AMC #1 fan
        \_ sorry, busy working.  it's the season.  its hard to be funny
           when you're working your ass off and falling asleep by 10pm
           every night.  glad to know you're out there.  i'll be back!  -AMC
2003/11/18-19 [Politics/Foreign/MiddleEast/Iraq] UID:11123 Activity:high
11/18   Westly Clark on Fox News...
        http://tinyurl.com/vf9k
        \_ Wow.  That was really painful to watch.
        \_ thank you for confirming every stereotype about how dishonest
           and willfully ignorant Fox "News" is.  That's not an interview,
           it's a verbal attack.
           \_ Thankfully, Wes recognized this and attacked the question.  Go
              Wes!
           \_ hahahhahaha, now you know how conservatives feel about the
              liberal media.  take that, crackerjack!
              \_ liberal media?  proof it?  Last time I checked, the media
                 has been puppet of Bush's policy.
                 \_ last time I posted about the NYT with examples it got
                    deleted so fucking fast the bits flew off the hard drive.
                    I could repost but why don't you just search the archive
                    for NYT instead?  the last time you checked you were so
                    left wing you think the SF chronicle is a bastion of
                    right wing conservatism.
        \_ Isn't it Wesley?
           \_ yes.
        \_ Holy Smokes!  Fox News is SLIMY!
           \_ Hot damn!  Clark put that putz in his place!
              \_ I agree.
              \_ Well, he did ok but I think the question caught him off
                 guard. It was a calculated smear attempt. Any criticism
                 of the war or its purpose is twisted into an attack on the
                 armed forces. Fucking disgusting.
        \_ The guy does not appreciate the significance of Posse
           Comitatus.
           He has a very poor choice of words and demeanor.
           If a Fox news anchor can rattle him...
           \_ Maybe, but have you heard Bush speak?  A kindergartner could
              beat him in a fair debate...
                \_ Including calling the largest land war since
                   Vietnam a 'side-show'.  He predicted a sixth
                   month war on CNN.
                   \_ Uh, hello?  Russia/Afghanistan?  Iran/Iraq?  Hutsi/Tutsi?
                      Gulf War I?  How stupid can you be?
                        \_ I did not realize the U.S. committed troops
                           to the first three you mentioned. Source?
                           \_ No one said "only US wars".  Anyway, we were
                              involved in the first two and smart enough to
                              let the europeans really seriously fuck up the
                              third one without us.
                   \_ I thought our troop commitment in Gulf War I was much
                      larger than GWII.  Hmm.  Must do research.
                        \_ You guys aren't making much sense.  Sixth month war?
                           I thought out troop commitment?  You make the
                           ESL guys look like Shakespeare.
                           \_ Chill out, guy.  1 typo != ESL.  You might want
                              to reread the preceding comment a little less
                              selectively;
                              "...the largest land war since Vietnam..."
                                \_ Obviously he was talking only about ones
                                   that the US was a primary player in, bc who
                                   gives a damn about others, right?
                                   \_ Uhm, the US *was* the primary player in
                                      Gulf War I.  Are you really this obtuse
                                      and stupid or are you merely trolling?
                                   \_ Obviously?  No.  You're adding that
                                      after the fact.  "US" is two letters.
                                      If he meant US, he could've easily said
                                      US.  And a lot of us give a whole lot of
                                         sound urbane unmolested, Logicboy!
                                      damn about the others.
                                      \_ No!  NOOO!  Do not you be logical!
                                         Let us rant about Shakespeare to
                                         sound urbane and avoid demonstrating
                                         our vapid stupidity unmolested,
                                         Logicboy!
2003/11/18 [Computer/Rants] UID:11124 Activity:high
11/18   Outsourcing not the panacea of cost-cutting
        http://news.com.com/2100-1011-5108257.html
        \_ And you know what? The folks making the decision will ignore this
           and every other such report in their greed. Good luck out there.
           I predict most grunt software workers today are not so far from
           the skilled manufacturing worker bees of a few generations ago.
           \_ the report says that 71% of companies save money when they
              outsource, while 9% have greater expense.  That sounds
              like a good argument for outsourcing.  -tom
              \_ It depends on what you're outsourcing. Just because it is
                 cheaper doesn't mean you maintain the same level of service.
                 See: http://csua.org/u/518
              outsource, 9% have greater expense.  That sounds like a good
              argument for outsourcing.  -tom
2003/11/18 [Science/GlobalWarming] UID:11125 Activity:very high
11/18   Wasn't ethanol proven to have almost no effect on the quality of
        gasoline?
        \_ Pretty much, yeah.  You can split hairs over it but not really.
           \_ So why was so much money added to the energy bill for this?
              Also, do you have any links about what it's supposed to do
              vs what it does?  I heard it all just evaporated.
              \_ it lowers the energy density of the gasoline. It sends a
                 bit of money to the farm states where the ethanol is produced.
                  bit of money to the farm states where the ethanlo is produced.
                  \_ It also sends a LOT of money to ADM, which is a big
                     policitian-buyer.
                    \_ True.  And makes deluded "environmentalists" happy.
                       Even though more energy is used in the final analysis;
                       \_ Don't kid yourself.  The Energy Bill is just one
                          big barrel of pork.  No one in this Congress cares
                          what environmentalists think, not real ones and not
                          the imagined demons you're talking about.  BTW, check
                          out King George's latest decision on textile tariffs?
                          Whatta free trader!
                       California has more oilfields than cornfields....
        \_ What do you mean "the quality of gasoline"?
           You been listening to Rush Limbaugh again?
           \_ boy, how does it feel being a dupe of the most evil corp.s that
              i'm sure you claim to hate?  See ADM and Sierra club posts below
           \_ Christ no.  I'd heard that it was supposed to replace MTBE as an
              octane additive but that it evaporates and you're basically left
              with plain old gasoline sans MTBE.  Thanks for the link, what
              about counterarguments?
              \_ Do you have any? I don't know of any. I guess that site
                 would suggest that you want to increase the VoC requirements
                 so that it doesn't evaporate off.
        \_ Doesn't it do what MTBE does?
           \_ poison the water table?  no, it doesn't.
        \_ Ethanol is a ludicrous fuel made out of corn, at a cost far higher
           than the petroleum it replaces, produced with a huge government tax
           subsidy, which started during the energy crisis a quarter-century ago
           and has long since become a classic case study of stupid policy
           entrenched by special interests (in this case farmers and Archer Daniels
           Midland, the company responsible for the fabulous discovery that if you
           tell the government what to do in commercials on every Sunday talk show,
           the government apparently is powerless to resist). - Michael Kinsley
        \_ the Sierra Club is suing some Ethanol plants.
           http://indiana.sierraclub.org/Sierran/03-1/EthanolPlants.asp
                     policitian-buyer.
        \_ What do you mean "the quality of gasoline"?
           http://www.sentex.net/~crfa/ethaair.html
           You been listing to Rush Limbaugh again?
2003/11/18 [Computer/SW/OS/Solaris, Computer/SW/Unix] UID:29640 Activity:very high
11/17   What's the Unix command to see how fast the CPU is?
        \_ dmesg
           \_ I just tried this on Soda and it didn't work, just got:
              dmesg: Command not found.
        \_ on Linux: cat /proc/cpuinfo  or  x86info
        \_ /var/run/dmesg.boot
        \_ OK, so what's the real command to see how fast the CPU is?  -op
           \_ What exactly are you looking for thet the above do not provide?
        \_ it would help if you mentioned which unix you were using.  in case
           you didn't know, it depends.
           \_ Sun, Solaris  -op
2003/11/18 [Computer/HW/IO] UID:29641 Activity:very high
11/17   Anyone know about using 2 mice at once?  I want to have a PS/2 pointer
        and a USB mouse at the same time so i can switch back and forth at
        will.
        \_ what OS?  Windows?  yeah, works fine.
        \_ I do this in Linux (wireless USB and PS/2 mouse) and it also works
           fine. Keyboards, too. --dim
           \_ Schweet, thanks guys. -op
2003/11/18 [Computer/SW/Unix] UID:29642 Activity:nil
11/18   How do you remove newlines with a one-line sed command
        cat /etc/motd | sed "s/\n//"   doesn't do it.
        \_ tr -d "\012" < /etc/motd
           \_ sweet! thanks.
2017/09/21 [General] UID:1000 Activity:popular
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Berkeley CSUA MOTD:2003:November:18 Tuesday <Monday, Wednesday>