Berkeley CSUA MOTD:2002:July:02 Tuesday <Monday, Wednesday>
Berkeley CSUA MOTD
2002/7/2 [Science/Biology] UID:25258 Activity:kinda low
7/1     This is your brain. This is your brain on pot. Pot is harmless. Use it.
        \_ well the Japs are skitzo to begin with, so the data may be skewed.
                    \________\_ the educated response...
2002/7/2 [Computer/SW/Mail] UID:25259 Activity:kinda low
7/1     What's the best file swapping client to grab a copy of war3?
        \_ Just do it the old fashion way... usenet.
        \_ Got mine from usenet.  Works great.
        \_  Best 8 bucks/month I ever spent.  -John
           \_ obYermom
2002/7/2 [Computer/SW/Unix] UID:25260 Activity:high
7/1     How to view a text file on a FTP site when I am using plain-old
        text FTP client?  Thanks
        \_ get <filename> | more
           \_ |more .  no space.
        \_ How to know viewing text file in FTP site when using text FTP
           clients?  Is much thanks you!
2002/7/2 [Computer/SW/Apps/Media, Computer/SW/OS/Windows] UID:25261 Activity:kinda low
7/1     Ross Anderson on TCPA/Palladium:
        \_ What a chill wind from Redmond blows...
2002/7/2-3 [Computer/SW/Database] UID:25262 Activity:high
7/2     ufsdump manpages say that the filesystem needs to be unmounted to
        do a correct dump. Well, I can't really just unmount the filesystem
        once a week... Do people actually use dump/ufsdump?
        \_ yes.  ignore the manpage.  -tom
           \_ I should say, ignore the manpage unless you're backing up
              something like an Oracle server where the bulk of your
              interesting data is in files which are likely to change while
              the dump is going on.  -tom
              \_ Doing backup of /var/mail on a busy mail server often fails
                 because of files being constantly accessed.
        \_ It's a good suggestion. Would be nice if it were possible.
        \_ Recent Solaris 8 HW releases have a feature called ufs snapshots.
           You can create a read-only snapshot of a file system that doesn't
           change for backup purposes.  I had some problems with snapshots but
           \_ I think the read-only snapshot will have the same problem as
              ufsdump--the files could change while the snapshot is being
              read/written.  -tom
              \_ Not entirely clear on the concept, but is this sort of thing
                 alleviated by jfs?  I.e. does it kind of keep track of
                 what is changing at any given point and back it up
                 correctly?  -John
              \_ but the point of the snapshot is that even if the files are
                 open and being written to, changes wont be made to the files
                 in the snapshot while the snapshot is active... worst case
                 scenario is that something is writing to the file and you
                 only get half the write, but you can come back to the same
                 snapshot an hour later and it will still look like that.
                 \_ Well, sure, you can back up the snapshot without ufsdump
                    failing, but if the snapshot contains files in an
                    inconsistent state (say, an Oracle database that was
                    in the process of writing a transaction), your good
                    ufsdump won't let you restore the system to a consistent
                    state.  -tom
                    \_ that's why it is probably a good idea to stop the
                       database app before taking a snapshot.
                       \_ Has anyone played with Veritas's Oracle backup?
                          I seem to recall it claims to be able to deal
                          with running databases no problem.  -John
                          \_ Yes, it works.  It uses a script to change the
                             Oracle database into backup mode and then does
                             the backup.  And yes, we have been able to
                             restore. You need DBED in order to do any of
                             the fancier stuff.  -mlee
                          \_ Y'know, for all the shit I've talked about it, DB2
                             really made backups very simple.  It's probably
                             not any harder than oracle, but it felt cleaner
                             somehow.  --scotsman
        \_ At one place I was at we did live dumps for dailies and weeklies
           but once a month took everything down and did single user mode
           fulls.  Needless to say this was a total bitch but yes some people
           do this.
2002/7/2-3 [Politics/Foreign/MiddleEast/Israel, Politics/Domestic/California] UID:25263 Activity:high
7/2     Hillary votes in favor of using military force to free Americans
        held by ICC.,,3-344149,00.html
        \_ And?
           \_ And I'm shocked and horribly disappointed she would vote for
              this horrendous PR garbage.
        \_ I can't believe the article didn't call the act by the name
           given to it by some Europeans: The Netherlands Invasion Act.
        \_ "The idea that its some right-wing paranoid fear about the
           International Criminal Court (ICC) is not true."
           Sigh...  right wing has nothing to do with it.  Those who are
           against it in this country are those with the most to lose: the
           corporations committing human rights violations the world over
           and, by extension, the politicians who must back them to remain
           in power.  oh yeah, and the military by yet another extension
           of the corporate structure.
           \_Riiiiight.  Include in there the people who believe that giving the
             rest of the world the power to yank our chain whenever they like
             isn't a good idea.  Hell, when the UN can have a conference on
             racism that condemns Jews (not to mention the Jenin fiasco), it
             would be insane to give the current world forum any power, real or
             imaginary over the US.
             \_ "Condemns Jews"? Right. Any criticism of israel is anti-semitic.
2002/7/2-3 [Recreation/Dating, Politics/Foreign/Asia/China] UID:25264 Activity:high
7/2     Doesn't that look like Maggie Cheung?
        \_ Maggie doesn't have socks that color.
        \_ Uh, Maggie Cheung is actually good looking, unlike your picture.
        \_ yes, yes, all asians look alike.  nothing to see here.
           \_ But I think they look alike even though I'm Asian myself.
              \_ little, yellow, different
                 \_ 14/18.
                 \_ Damn, only 8/18.  --- Chinese
                 \_ 9/18. D'oh.
                 \_ 6/18.  Damn!  The test was hard.  --chinese
           And yes, I agree.
           \_ You are on crack.  Maggie Cheung is way hotter.
        \_ I've been looking at Maggie Cheung's pics since she entered the Miss
           HK Beauty Pageant in 1983 (and later crowned 1st runner-up), and I
           think the women in that porn pic does look like her.  (BTW I vaguely
           remember she was #29 out of 30 contestants.)
           \_ The porn lady's hair sucks.  Her eyebrows are different.
              Maggie's face is also more round.
           \_ when the "memoirs of a geisha" movie comes out
              american audiences will finally know her
2002/7/2-3 [Reference/History, Computer/SW/Security, Politics/Domestic/President/Bush] UID:25265 Activity:nil
7/2     The Prez has lots of experience with corporate fraud:
        \_ so? if it really ends up leading to reform, i don't care
           what he did in the past.  let's judge him by his current actions,
           not past actions.  they're bad enough.
           \_ You really think we have any real chance of seeing reform?
2002/7/2-3 [Transportation/Airplane, Reference/Military, Politics/Foreign/Europe] UID:25266 Activity:high
7/2     Anyone reading the Yahoo news on the plane crash in Germany?  How come
        tens of photos are about the wreckage of the Tupolev?  Where's the
        wreckage of the 757?
        \_ Maybe cuz the 757 is a cargo plane and there weren't any children
           on board and no one died 'cept for the crew?
2002/7/2 [Computer/Companies/Google, Computer/SW/Unix] UID:25267 Activity:nil
7/2     ufsdumper guy here. While I'm at it, I was wondering what sort of
        dumping schedule do people use? 0 5 5 5 3? 0 5 5 5 5? 0 0 0 0 0? Also,
        how do you backup multiple partitions with one fell swoop? I've been
        reading around on google but there is a lot of conflicting advice.
        \_ It depends. How big are your backups, how important are they,
           how much do they change, how long can your system be down if
           you need to recover from tape, how quick do you need to be able
           to recover a file from a backup?
           \_ What about the multiple partitions part?
              \_ You just dump them sequentially to a NONREWINDING tape device.
2002/7/2-4 [Computer/SW/Unix] UID:25268 Activity:very high
7/2     Does it make sense to run NFS without NIS/NIS+? I've heard that file
        permissions won't work if you're running NFS w/o NIS.
        \_ nfs can run perfectly fine w/o NIS... thers not dependancy
           either way.. the file perm shit is dumb and wrong or you badly
           misunderstood... blah why do i post in the motd? -shac
           \_ It's good that you post on the motd. Not the dumbass posters
              who haven't figured out how to google.
        \_ NIS is not required to run NFS but you still have to come up with
           a way to synchronize the UID's and login names on all machines
           accessing NFS file systems if you care about file ownership.
           Here are some possible ways of doing this:
           1) rebuild the /etc/passwd and /etc/group files on all of your hosts
              (using the default portion of the file that came with the OS and
               the site added entries)
           2) use NIS.
           3) use LDAP
           DON'T use NIS+ as it has been EOLed in future solaris releases.
        \_ OP here. Sorry for the dumbass question. My problem was that I
           didn't realize that root has *less* access than other users by
           default. This is a good url:
           \_ There's a good reason for it.  For those too lazy to read the
              URL, I assume it's going to say that root is usually mapped to
              'nobody' because otherwise you're in the situation where someone
              else can plug their box into your network.  They're suddenly root
              on all your nfs shares.  Bad news.
                \_ as opposed to being able to su to any user on your NFS
                   shares--not a whole lot of difference.  If you're exporting
                   NFS to people you don't trust, you've already lost. -tom
                   \_ It's not about people, it's about physical access to
                      the network.  NFS wasn't designed to be secure but at
                      least they can't trojan system binaries as root, only
                      user owned files.  This is an important difference.
                      Security isn't all or nothing.  Layers, son, layers.
                        \_ uh, you're exporting system binaries on writable
                           filesystems via NFS? you need more than layers. -tom
                           \_ FYI, robust NFS implementations support strong
                              authentication methods including kerberos 5.
                              Unfortunately, Linux NFS client doesn't support
                              any of that fancy authentication stuff so you
                              must choose between Linux and security..
                           \_ Uh, you've never used a dickless client? i have
                              \_ Did you miss the part about "writable
                                 filesystems"?  A diskless client doesn't need
                                 to be able to write to its /usr partition.
                                 If you allow this, then you're an accident
                                 waiting to happen.  --scotsman
                                 \_ Nope.  Your call.  Not my problem.  You'll
                                    find out the hard way one day.
                              exactly what i need, thanks for all your help.
                              you can stop helping anytime... you've already
                              provided such great help from your vast depth
                              of knowledge from working with so many diverse
                              systems over the course of your lengthy career,
                              i couldn't possibly ask you to help any more
                              than you already have.
                              \_ You know, you can stop listening also.  It's
                                 not like you're a powerless victim.
        \_ OP: tom is helpful. so is shaq.
        \_ OP: tom is helpful. so is shaq. YMMV.
           \_ tom is the techie guru god of all knowing.  tom has never been
              wrong.  i religiously follow all of toms advice.
              \_ I don't know everything.  But I probably know more than you
                 do.  -tom
                 \_ I won't lick your ass, but I appreciate your postings.
                    Don't always agree wtih you, but do appreciate them.
                 \_ What?  nonononono this is wrong.  You know *EVERYTHING*!
                    You've *NEVER* been wrong!  It's *NEVER* happened!
                    \_ Sarcasm aside, not knowing everything and never being
                       wrong are not mutually exclusive.
                       \_ But when you have an opinion about *EVERYTHING* and
                          you're *NEVER* wrong, you therefore know everything
                          as well.  Life is good.
                          \_ obLithium.
2019/01/23 [General] UID:1000 Activity:popular
Berkeley CSUA MOTD:2002:July:02 Tuesday <Monday, Wednesday>