Berkeley CSUA MOTD:2001:February:13 Tuesday <Monday, Wednesday>
Berkeley CSUA MOTD
2001/2/13 [Computer/SW/P2P] UID:20574 Activity:nil
2/12    Napster opinion posted here:
        (reserved for educational purposes only)
2001/2/13-14 [Computer/SW/Mail, Computer/SW/Security] UID:20575 Activity:high
2/12    Is there a FAQ for getting pgp to work with automatically
        with pine spec. for on soda? Sth about the way I've got
        the filters options setup or the "display.csh" script I set
        up isn't working. -ulysses
        \_ The happy ending. Somebody fixed something because the
           filter works all of a sudden. Note that, if anybody
           else has a problem, check out /usr/local/bin/pgpdecode.
        \_  you should switch to mutt.  mutt integrates with
            pgp very well.
            \_ Yeah until you upgrade.  Remember, the mutt development team
               purposefully changes pgp config flags every release (to make
               sure us mortals don't get rusty).
            \_ Suggestion appreciated and i will look at mutt, but I know
               pine can work with pgp since it works on another system I use
               w/o problems. Does anybody use pine w/ pgp and could they send
               me perhaps the relevant portions of their pinerc and display
               script? -ulysses
        \_ Have you tried pgp4pine?
           \_ Looks good, though I bet I lack the fu to install this in my home
              directory (i.e. without being root on soda). -ulysses
                \_ if you're using pine, you clearly lack fu
                   \_ real men read thier mail with shell.
                      \_ pinesh! pinesh! pinesh is the Standard!!! Uhh...
                         \_ In bourne shell a paging mail reader is
                            about 5-10 lines of code. A real man can
                            type it all in on the command line.
        \_ Just add these to your .pinerc, nothing else needed:
        display-filters=_BEGINNING("-----BEGIN PGP")_ /usr/local/bin/pgp -f
        sending-filters=/usr/local/bin/pgp -feast _RECIPIENTS_
           \_ Can I still send emails to people who doesn't have PGP software?
             \_ are you chinese? -ali
        \_ That is NOT all you have to do.
2001/2/13 [Uncategorized] UID:20576 Activity:very high 66%like:20971 57%like:20170
2/12    Poll. Most of the time I am (a):
        motd reader     |******
        motd poster     |****
        motd distorter  |***
        motd censorer   |*
             \_ censor, you [CENSORED]
        motd nuker      |
        motd mutator    |*
        motd reformator |*
        loser           |*************
        kchang (loser)  |*
        tom             |**
        ali             |***
        psb             |****
        proud troll     |*
        stupid troll    |*
        ignorant troll  |*
        earning twink
          points        |*
        motd?  huh?     |***
        just amused     |*
        picker          |
        grinner         |
        lover           |
        sinner          |
        joker           |
        smoker          |
        midnight toker  |
        looking for tjb |*
        tjb            *|
        bitch           |*
        mother          |*
        lover           |*
        sinner          |*
        saint           |*
        \_ some of these are redundant. loser is inclusive of troll,
           censor, nuker, mutator. And censor is inclusive of
           tom and ali.
2001/2/13-14 [Computer/SW/Languages/C_Cplusplus, Computer/SW/Editors/Emacs] UID:20577 Activity:nil
2/12    In emacs I can do C-X C-F *.cc and all my cc files get loaded in.
        How do I do this in XEmacs?
        \_ M-! gnuclient -q *.cc
        \_ ^X^Cvi *.cc^M
2001/2/13 [Computer/SW/Unix] UID:20578 Activity:nil
2/12    uniq only strips duplicates that are adjacent to one another.
        What is an easy way to strip ALL duplicates from a file?
        \_ foo | sort | uniq
            \_ Boy, I feel as though i deserve a good whacking with
               a thick clue stick.  Thanks, i'm an idiot. -TOP
                (and this is why i don't sign my posts).
                \_ sort -u is cooler.
2001/2/13 [Computer/SW/OS/FreeBSD, Computer/SW/Languages/Web] UID:20579 Activity:nil
2/12    We're Windoze weenies running Win2K for web serving, SMTP, and
        file serving.  We would like to put either OpenBSD or Red Hat
        Linux up and slowly migrate services here, including backup.
        The argument for OpenBSD is that, as newbies, we're less prone
        to suffer for security holes.  The argument for Red Hat is that
        it's widely supported, and we should learn how to secure it
        day by day anyway.  When all is said and done, which is
        better for our purposes?
        \_ I would run OpenBSD for SMTP and file sharing (I'm assuming
           you want SAMBA, but if you want NFS, OpenBSD supports v3,
           unlike LinSUX). You would probably be better off running
           LinSUX for web serving, since you can get nifty cool web
           stuff like PHP, ASP (yes M$ ASP is available on Linux,
           via a company called ChiliSoft AKA Cobalt AKA Sun), JSP,
           Servlets, FrontPage Extensions, etc. to run on LinSUX much
           easier than *BSD and Solaris.
           If you want a dedicated web serving appliance with LinSUX
           take a look at the Cobalt (AKA Sun) RaQ3/4, they are pretty
           cheap and do web stuff pretty well (all that nifty web stuff
           is pre-installed and configured (except JSP & Servlets) on
           the RaQs).
2001/2/13 [Computer/SW/Security, Computer/SW/OS] UID:20580 Activity:nil
.nuS eht morf detapissid si taeh woh sa yaw emaS _\
.toidi ,loof a eb t'noD  ?flesruoY _\
!toidi na ton s'ohw enoemos _\
.lairetam  gnilooc a gnitalba ro gnitaropave ni ssam fo tol
 a etsaw ot tnaw uoy sselnu ,eciohc ylno rey s'ti ,erehpsomta
on evah uoy nehw tub ,si noitcudnoc sa taeh fo dir gnitteg ta
tneiciffe sa t'nsi noitaidar ydob kcalB  .srotaidar esu yeht _\
ME ycneuqerf wol ,derarfni _\
.niaga gnitsop erofeb "eulc" pu gnikool yb trats
ot tnaw thgim uoy ,yranoitcid eht fo gnikaeps
dna ,hO  .noitseuq eht gnisserdda yaw yna ni ro
 gnirewsna yllautca tuohtiw ,noitamrofni
deriuqca ylisae htiw pu flesmih gniffup
 si loof siht taht gniyas m'I yllautca ,oN _\
.suoixonbo dna diputs gnieb tsuj erew
uoY  .uoy pleh t'now yranoitcid eht tub yrt eciN _\
 sa "suoiceps" dna "citnames" spahreP  .yranoitcid
eht ni "yrtsihpos" pu kool -- pleh deen uoy spahreP _\
.muucav a si ecaps taht esimerp eslaf eht n desab si
"...woh ]ps[mucav a si ecaps fI"  .si ti tahw rof tcaf fo
noitcerroc elpmis a esingocer ot sseleulc oot era sretsop
dtom emos ,yletanutrofnU  .gniyas saw I tahw s'tahT  .seY _\
.muucav a ton si ecaps taht yas ot gniyrt tsuj si sih kniht I _\
?seicnavelerri citoidi gnituops tsuj
uoy era rO  ?taeh tnacifingis sevomer sag fo ytisned wol
siht taht tressa ot gniyrt uoy erA  ?tniop ruoy s'tahW _\
.derusaem yllanosrep
t'nevah I  .yas yeht oS  .ecaps peed ni sretemitnec cibuc 01
rep mota negordyh 1 ylhguoR  .muucav erup/eurt a t'nsi ecapS _\
?tfarcecaps a ni detapissid taeh si woh mucav a si ecaps fI     21/2

.stsop dtom ruoy sa devirtnoc dna sseltniop
sa si efil ruoy esuaceb esuoh eht fo tuo ssa tnagorra
,taf ,yzal ruoy gnikcik si mom rey ,sdrow rehto nI _\
.naelc ot ssel reh sevael ti sa tnemegnarra wen eht ekil
lliw diam ehT  .oot ,htnom txen esuoh eht gnitaroceder
,haey hO  .dtom eht tide ot emit evah llits I dna %01 ni
gnittup ,serugif 6 elbatrofmoc gnikam m'I ,serianoillim
-itlum-itlum-itlum era stnerap ym ,rehgih si egagtrom yM _\
                )hcus dna stnemtsevni aiv erom nrae
I tub ,ssel si yralas yM .gniht erugif 6 taht
drawot emocni yralas-non redisnoc t'nod I ,WTB(
 eldi eht fo rebmem eb ot noos - .detsevnier era
sdnedivid rehto eht lla ,nwo I dnuf latum elgnis a no
sdnedivid yb derevoc si erutidnepxe ylraey ym tub
,tnempiuqe retupmoc ro sehtolc yub I yllanoisaccO
.)om/ecnanetniam 02$ ,om/ecnarusni 05$ ,om/sag 05$(
rac ym dna )om/96$( LSD era evah I stsoc gnirrucer
ylno ehT .ereht stsoc no kcab tuc I os ,stnerap ym
htiw emoh ta evil I .tnuoocca tekram yenom ym otni
yltcerid tser eht ,PPSE ot %01 ,)k(104 ot %51 m'I _\
.ekam ew hcum woh
fo daetsni dneps ew elttil woh no etepmoc ot deen ew taht das
s'ti hguohtlA  .rehtie serugif 6 gnikam ton m'I dna ,)k(104
ym ot %11 gnitubirtnoc dna )elbitcuded-xat-non( stnerap ym ot
om/K1$ gnidnes dna htnom a tnemyap egagtrom 0062$ gnikam m'I _\
.rehtie serugif 6 gnikam ton gnikam m'I
dna tnuocca tekram yenom ym otni tisoped tcerid yb raey
 a K04 ~ gnivas m'I ?K54 ~ ?ekam uoy od hcum woH .K02 ylnO _\
yug lagurf-  .serugif 6 gnikam ton m'I dnA  .yaw taht
raey a K02 gnivas ot elba m'I  .tnuocca taht morf wardhtiw reve
TON OD dna tnuocca sgnivas a otni kcehcyap ruoy fo noitrop a tup ot
tisoped yllacitamotua esU  !siht thguorht tnew ew thguoht I ,yeH _\
!lreP _\
.yenom hcum oot stsoc elif txet a ,ekorb era uoy fI _\
.siht od ot elif txet nialp a esu tsuj I _\
.txen eht ot refsnart dna egap a fo mottob eht ta pu ti ddA
.)esnepxe( - ro )tisoped( + saw ti fi drocer uoy erehw eno tsal a
 dna noitpircsed a ni etirw uoy erehw rehtona ,noitcasnart a fo
etad eht ni etirw uoy erehw nmuloc eno evah uoY .sselyap ro sgnol
morf koobeton 01.0$ a gnisu ekam nac uoY .regdel a dellac stI _\
.teehsdaerps yna naht siht ta retteb era yenoM tfosorciM dna nekciuQ _\
.sesnepxe ym kcart gnipeek
trats ot teehsdaerps gnikcik-ssa na rof gnikool ma I .ekorb ma I    21/2

.haissem repel ot woB _\
   ?toidi na tsuj uoy era ro tniop a evah uoy oD _\
 .)lairetam deripxe
thgirypoc tsael ta ro( lagel yletelpmoc gnirahs elpoep
 rof redrah ti sekam tsuj retspan nwod gnisolc taht si
ssenisub retspan elohw siht tuoba dnatsrednu t'nod I tahW _\
 .roop me ekam
.seibab yrc eht dna esuac eht era yehT .acillatem ttocyob _\
.erehwyna taht ees t'ndid I  ?meht tsniaga delur egduj ehT _\
!  /daolnwod/moc.hsemi.www//:ptth ta hsemi
tuokcehc ,tuokcalb retspaN a tuoba deirrow era uoy fo yna fI    21/2

.siht gnidaer er'uoy fi uoy era os tub
driew tib A  .enod llew yreV  ."?uohT trA erehW ,rehtorB hO" ees oG     21/2

neuy --  ?nekorb si gnihtemoS  .eromyna taht od
t'nseod ti yadot tuB  .drowssap emit-eno eht rof sksa dna yek eht
stnirp ti erehw ptf TN ym htiw krow ot desu tI  .egnarts s'tahT _\
?dnammoc laretil eht hguorht esu nac I dnammoc
a ereht si .drowssap emit-eno eht retne ot tpmorp on
si ereht tub yeks htiw ptf 59niW esu ot gniyrt ma I    21/2

P:  nedraG evilO ro s'noyL _\
.deirram teg ro pu ti eviG  .demood er'uoY _\
.daetsni kooc
ot dediced--hpargeleT no airottarT inazzaM ta noitavreser
 ym dellecnac tsuj I ,oslA  .yadrutaS no dekcehc I nehw
tfel ecaps dah yeht ,egelloC no anailiciS al airottarT yrT _\
 .raey tsal ecin
ylbanosaer saw taht ecalp a otni klaw ot elba yllautca saw I _\
.aedi doog a si gniht gnikooc eht ,WTB .emit txen
reilrae nalP .oga skeew owt neve snoitavreser teg t'ndluoc uoY _\
snoitavreser teg nac I ,tuo reh ekat ll'I _\
.neht tuo reh ekaT
.yadsruhT no rehtegot kcab teG  .yadot reh pmuD _\
.smelborp ruoy lla evlos lliw ti ,deirram teG _\
                 .tae ew elihw dna eraperp I elihw revres
ekirtsretnoc ym no retspan morf 3pm gnidaolnwod eb
t'nac I taht naem t'nseod siht tuB .ecalp eht etaroced
 dna naelc em pleh ot retsis ym dna kooc ot mom ym
teg dluohs I taht tnem uoy taht demussa I "kooc" yb _\
... tub ,siht wenk ydaerla snados tsom
epoh I  .revres ekirtsretnuoc ruoy no sdaolnwod retspaN
,dnuorgkcab eht ni gniralb VT ,stnecsednacni ton -- sesruoc
lareves ,erawrevlis ,rennid tileldnac naem ew ,"kooc" yb _\
.rebmemer lliw ehs gnihtemos si
erutseg eht ,laem tneced a kooc t'nac uoy fi nevE  .lufgninaem erom
hcum hcum si reh rof gnikooC  .gnivas htrow ton ylbaborp s'ti neht
,pihsnoitaler eht "evas" ot FG ruoy enid dna eniw ot deen uoy fi _\
.yaD-V rof sseletad --
.tser eht ni llif nac uoy kniht I .ecalp citnamor a ot tuo
reh ekaT .etalocohc illedrarihg emos dna evots roodtuo na
dnif dna lwob a ni )...cte ,sananab ,seirrebwarts ,wedyenoh
deppohc( stiurf emos teG  .em rof dekrow taht pit tresed ecin
a s'ereH  .tsaf yllaer kooc ot woh nrael retteb d'uoy tub
snoitavreser teg t'ndluoc uoy taht gniht doog a eb thgim ti
,esac taht nI .reh rof rennid gnikooc yb stniop erom erocs
yllaitnetop dluoc uoY .snoitavreser o/w elbaliava syawla
era .rJ slraC dna ,kcarC eht ni kcaJ ,gniK regruB ,sdlanoDcM _\
?pihsnoitaler ruo evas I nac ro sselepoh yletelpmoc
ti sI  .dekoob si gnihtyreve dna ,yad senitnelaV rof snalp
rennid ekam ot gniyrt ,dnuora gnillac m'I  !dewercs os ma I     21/2

 .adoC ro SFA yrt
esaelp ,retnuomotua eht ot ytilanoitcnuf ralimis deen uoy fI
 ).esaCraelC diputs fo esuaceb emit eht
lla deneppah siht dnA .ylnaelc ti toober neve t'ndluoc uoy
dna xob nuS ruoy esu t'ndluoc uoy ,ytivitcennoc tsol ro nwod
tnew sretsam +SIN/SIN eht ro srevres eht fo yna fi dna ocsiC
ta sexob ruo lla no sfotua dah eW .ereht neeb ev'I ,em tsurT(
.smelborp fo stros lla evah lliw uoy ,gninnur ti teg uoy fi nevE
.eugalp eht ekil dediova eb dluohs taht SOP yletelpmoc a stI
?retnuomotua eht htiw od ot gniyrt uoy era yltcaxe tahw dnA


:QAF retnuomotuA eht fo trap siraloS
eht ta kool a ekaT .dednemmocer ton tub ,elbissop si ti seY _\
?elbissop neve siht sI  .siralos
rednu +SIN gninnur TUOHTIW seirotcerid emoh tnuomotua ot gniyrt m'I
?sQAF rehto yna ereht erA  .gnikrow gniht nmad eht teg ot elba ton
llits m'I tub gro.plehnus.www morf retnuomotua no sQAF eht dewollof I   21/2

?scamEX ni siht od I od woH
  .ni dedaol teg selif cc ym lla dna cc.* F-C X-C od nac I scame nI     21/2

.ila dna mot
fo evisulcni si rosnec dnA .rotatum ,rekun ,rosnec
,llort fo evisulcni si resol .tnadnuder era eseht fo emos _\
*|           tnias
*|          rennis
*|           revol
|               enorc
*|          rehtom
*|              nediam
*|           hctib
|*              bjt
*| bjt rof gnikool
|  rekot thgindim
|               rekoms
|               rekoj
|               rennis
|               revol
|               rennirg
|               rekcip
*|      desuma tsuj
***|    ?huh  ?dtom
*|      stniop
kniwt gninrae
*|      llort tnarongi
*|      llort diputs
*|      llort duorp
|               bsp!
****|             bsp
***|             ila
**|             mot
*|  )resol( gnahck
*************|          resol
*| rotamrofer dtom
*|    rotatum dtom
|       rekun dtom
]DEROSNEC[ uoy ,rosnec _\
*|      rerosnec dtom
***|    retrotsid dtom
****|   retsop dtom
******| redaer dtom
:)a( ma I emit eht fo tsoM .lloP        21/2

.llehs htiw liam reiht daer nem laer _\
uf kcal ylraelc uoy ,enip gnisu er'uoy fi _\
sessylu- .)ados no toor gnieb tuohtiw .e.i( yrotcerid
 emoh ym ni siht llatsni ot uf eht kcal I teb I hguoht ,doog skooL _\
/ed.eniltalf.enip4pgp//:ptth ?enip4pgp deirt uoy evaH _\
sessylu- ?tpircs
 yalpsid dna crenip rieht fo snoitrop tnaveler eht spahrep em
 dnes yeht dluoc dna pgp /w enip esu ydobyna seoD .smelborp o/w
 esu I metsys rehtona no skrow ti ecnis pgp htiw krow nac enip
wonk I tub ,ttum ta kool lliw i dna detaicerppa noitsegguS _\
.)ytsur teg t'nod slatrom su erus
ekam ot( esaeler yreve sgalf gifnoc pgp segnahc yllufesoprup
maet tnempoleved ttum eht ,rebmemeR  .edargpu uoy litnu haeY _\
.llew yrev pgp
htiw setargetni ttum  .ttum ot hctiws dluohs uoy  _\
sessylu- .gnikrow t'nsi pu
 tes I tpircs "hsc.yalpsid" eht ro putes snoitpo sretlif eht
 tog ev'I yaw eht tuoba htS ?ados no rof .ceps enip htiw
yllacitamotua htiw krow ot pgp gnitteg rof QAF a ereht sI       21/2

.relooc si u- tros _\
.)stsop ym ngis t'nod i yhw si siht dna(
POT- .toidi na m'i ,sknahT  .kcits eulc kciht a
htiw gnikcahw doog a evresed i hguoht sa leef I ,yoB _\
'++}_${nees$ sselnu tnirp' en- lrep
:redro lanigiro sti ni elif eht peek ot tnaw uoy fi ,rO _\
qinu | tros | oof _\
?elif a morf setacilpud LLA pirts ot yaw ysae na si tahW
.rehtona eno ot tnecajda era taht setacilpud spirts ylno qinu    21/2

.yrassecen sa strop
gnippam dna )tuo semoc 1.4.2 htiw gnihtemos litnu( SFresieR
htiw ekardnaM-xuniL gninnur ,xob TAN a dniheb enihcam eht
gnivael er'ew ,elpoep wef a htiw gnitlusnoc retfa ,sknahT _\
.suoivbo t'nsaw taht esac ni ,eulc on sah tnadnopser sihT _\
.)sQaR eht
no )stelvreS & PSJ tpecxe( derugifnoc dna dellatsni-erp si
ffuts bew ytfin taht lla( llew ytterp ffuts bew od dna paehc
 ytterp era yeht ,4/3QaR )nuS AKA( tlaboC eht ta kool a ekat
XUSniL htiw ecnailppa gnivres bew detacided a tnaw uoy fI
 .siraloS dna DSB* naht reisae
hcum XUSniL no nur ot .cte ,snoisnetxE egaPtnorF ,stelvreS
,PSJ ,)nuS AKA tlaboC AKA tfoSilihC dellac ynapmoc a aiv
,xuniL no elbaliava si PSA $M sey( PSA ,PHP ekil ffuts
bew looc ytfin teg nac uoy ecnis ,gnivres bew rof XUSniL
gninnur ffo retteb eb ylbaborp dluow uoY .)XUSniL ekilnu
,3v stroppus DSBnepO ,SFN tnaw uoy fi tub ,ABMAS tnaw uoy
gnimussa m'I( gnirahs elif dna PTMS rof DSBnepO nur dluow I _\
?sesoprup ruo rof retteb
si hcihw ,enod dna dias si lla nehW  .yawyna yad yb yad
ti eruces ot woh nrael dluohs ew dna ,detroppus ylediw s'ti
taht si taH deR rof tnemugra ehT  .seloh ytiruces rof reffus ot
enorp ssel er'ew ,seibwen sa ,taht si DSBnepO rof tnemugra ehT
.pukcab gnidulcni ,ereh secivres etargim ylwols dna pu xuniL
taH deR ro DSBnepO rehtie tup ot ekil dluow eW  .gnivres elif
dna ,PTMS ,gnivres bew rof K2niW gninnur seineew ezodniW er'eW    21/2

.yldipar etiuq daerps ot dnet sesuriv
eseht dlrow swodniW eht ni stoidi fi arohtelp a
stsixe ereht ecnis dnA .lavivrus rieht rof resu
eht fo ycoidi eht no dneped sesuriv esehT .epoN _\
.swolBniW esu t'nod I dalG ?s09 ylrae eht fo
mroW tenretnI eht ekil egdelwonk ppA/SO ro lliks
gnidoc laer yna eriuqer t'nseod "suriv" siht ,oS _\
.margorp eht snur hcihw ,ti no
 kcilc-elbuod ot dnet sresu ;elbatucexe na tsuj si eno sihT _\
?krow siht seod woH ?margorp gniweiv eht naht
rehtar egami reiht gnitucexe trats ot margorp gniweiv eht
ni swolfrevo reffub tiolpxe yeht od ,lareneg nI ?suriv a eb
nac egassem liame a woh dnatsrednu etiuq t'nod I .cificeps
swodniw eb ot smees ti tub ,ereht tuo suriv liame wen a si
ereht taht smees ti dna 30-1002-AC yrosivdA TREC daer tsuj I    21/2
2001/2/13-14 [Computer/Networking] UID:20581 Activity:moderate
2/13    Which companies around here give offices to regular grunts?  I know
        Apple, SGI, and Adobe do.  Who else?
        \_ I heard PeopleSoft does also.
        \_ Sun
        \_ Cisco doesn't. They are down to 8x8 cubes (used to be 10x10).
           The managers' offices have increased in size though. It must
           be good to be the boss...
           \_ How the hell can Cisco not have enough space for everyone?
              They've got square footage equivalent to Rhode Island just in
              the South Bay!
        \_ Apple doesn't in at least two buildings I've visited. Transmeta
           does do offices for grunts.
        \_ Remedy Corporation, depending on seniority
        \_ I was once a co-op at IBM Almaden in 1991 and I shared an office
           with one other engineer.
        \_ Wind River.
        \_ Xerox (in El Segundo, anyway)
2001/2/13-14 [Uncategorized] UID:20582 Activity:nil
2/13    Has anyone heard about email wiretap?  Anyone got pointers to the
        source code?
2001/2/13-14 [Computer/SW/OS/Windows] UID:20583 Activity:high
2/12    I just read CERT Advisory CA-2001-03 and it seems that there
        is a new email virus out there, but it seems to be windows
        specific. I don't quite understand how a email message can
        be a virus? In general, do they exploit buffer overflows in
        the viewing program to start executing thier image rather
        than the viewing program? How does this work?
        \_ A lot of the windows ones are visual basic scripts auto-executed
           by MAPI mail clients, or stupid users who click on them.  Most
           of the email ones I've seen lately dump a bunch of hex strings
           into a file and run the ensuing binary which infects a bunch
           of files and/or sends copies of itself to people in your
           contact lists/address books.  -John
        \_ This one is just an executable; users tend to double-click
           on it, which runs the program.
           \_ So, this "virus" doesn't require any real coding
              skill or OS/App knowledge like the Internet Worm
              of the early 90s? Glad I don't use WinBlows.
              \_ Nope. These viruses depend on the idiocy of the
                 user for their survival. And since there exists
                 a plethora if idiots in the Windows world these
                        \_ Sir Hilfinger talking about condoms? *shudder*
                 viruses tend to spread quite rapidly.
                 \_ Love him or hate him, he's right about the
                    "sandbox" concept. It's not new since Java already
                    does it but it's a good safeguard against even
                    the most idiotic of users:
                 \_ There's quite a plethora of idiots using real
                    OSen now too, but not enough to start the avalanche
                    of idiocy that the media calls a "virus" these, and
                    not enough with root access to cause real damage.
                    However, their numbers are quickly growing, and
                    the next big hole in RH may start an epidemic.
                    \_ So what if a virus takes out a RH box, based
                       on the level of people using RH these days
                       its just like a virus taking out a WinBlows
                       Recent RH releases remind me more and more
                       of WinBlows. Gnome is just as ugly and slow
                       as M$'s offerings. RH without a gui is okay,
                       but no where near as good as v 4.2.
                       \_ A well designed OS (I'm not saying one
                          even exists) shouldn't depend on having
                          its superuser being a security expert. The
                          its superuser be a security expert. The
                          users shouldn't be a reason of it to
                          fact that there are a lot of newbie RH
                          users shouldn't be a reason for it to
                          schmos on soda to have root access without
                          be vulnerable. If it was well designed it
                          should let people like me and 98% of the
                          schmos on soda have root access without
                          the worries associated with system
                          administration. People still need to own
                          and take care of their own machines. You
                          can't expect every one of them to take a
                          sysadmin certification course, read 20
                          O'Reilly books on security, and constantly
                          monitor CERT advisories.
                          \_ Agreed. I find OpenBSD goes pretty
                             far in this regard.
              \_ Actually, these viruses depend on the greed of Microsoft
                 for their survival.  It is unquestionably dangerous to
                 execute code received by email, yet Windows mail programs
                 do this for you if you simply double-click on them.  And
                 it is well known that if you send 100 people, even
                 literate ones, such an executable, at least some of them
                 will click on it.  So a well-designed mailer won't
                 auto-execute (or offer to auto-execute) stuff that's
                 potentially dangerous.  And in the Microsoft world Java,
                 postscript, and PDF are about the only things that aren't
                 potentially dangerous (they even mis-designed Word to the
                 extent that you can embed worms in it!).

                 so where's the greed part come in, you ask (as opposed to
                 simple stupidity)?  these vulnerabilities have been well
                 known for over 20 years, and have been plaguing Microsoft
                 customers since the advent of the Microsoft Network.  Yet
                 they haven't fixed the problem (until recently).  I believe
                 it's part of Microsoft's strategy to force everyone to use
                 Windows software by encouraging folk to mail everything
                 around in Microsoft proprietary formats.  Look ma!  It's
                 so easy to use!  i can just send Word documents or even
                 programs to my friends and they can just run them!  and
                 those poor folks without Windows can't ... guess they'll
                 have to convert.

                 oh, the recent change i mentioned-- if you download
                 the latest security patch to Outlook (i think), it
                 absolutely prevents you from running all manner of Mo'soft
                 exeuctables:  .bat, .exe, .vbs, .com, ad nauseum.
                 \_ Anyone thinks we can put together a civil lawsuit against
                    Micro$oft for this?
                    \_ Easily. It will cost millions though and probably
                       end up just being a publicity stunt. A great one,
2001/2/13-14 [Finance/Banking, Finance/Investment] UID:20584 Activity:high
2/13    Is it theoretically possible at all to achieve zero inflation and zero
        unemployment at the same time in a non-communist economy?
        \_ why don't you go stand in that circle in sproul with a friend and
           you can start a company together trading goods back and forth
           using a curency that you set that never changes.  you are both
           employed, and there is no inflation.  don't be communist
           and you're all set.  moron.
           \_ You call that an economy, moron?  I'm just asking a question on
              theory of economics stemmed from fading memory from ECON 100B.
              I'm not trying to promote communism or anything.
              \_  why not?  I was trying to make the point that dealing with
                  totally hypothetical and abstract ideas in economics is
                  pointless.  I realize lot's of shucksters and math grad
                  school dropouts make a living off of this, but its still
                  a fucking waste of time.
        \_ Uh no. Unemployment reflects some of those who are of working
           age who do not want to or are not capable of working. It will
           never be 0 unless you force all the housewifes, househusbands,
           and cripples to work.
           \_ Nah, unemployment only includes those who want to find work,
              but is so far unable to find one which he or she is willing
              to take.
        \_ who wants zero unemployment? isn't the goal zero forced employment?
        most of us have to work, but don't want to. there are also non-
        competitive currency models to consider. read
         \_ uhh, you do know that generally unemployment numbers do not count
            people who are not interested in working.  They are supposed to
            reflect the percentage of people who are looking for jobs but
            don't have one.  Otherwise the numbers would be a hell of a lot i
                \_ really? I did not know that. So in most european countries
                   ~ 10 - 12% of the people who want to find work can't?
                   Damn. It must suck to live there.
                   \_ yeah but they get generous welfare so they probably don't
        \_ not in human economy.  but probably true in the animal world.
           \_ nice try, but I would say that > 99.9% of animals (humans
              excluded) are unemployed.
                      look that hard.
                   \_ Unemployment is calculated differently in
                      some european countries -- they consider part-time
                      workers as un-employed.
                \_ agreed; unemployment numbers count only those interested
                in working. but the motivation behind the question is that
                most people are interested in working. this isn't true;
                most people don't want to do the work they're doing.
        \_ The statistics that I don't understand is "personal savings
           rate".  It is defined as the percentage of "disposable income"
           saved, but what exactly is "disposable income"?  Does that
           include 401k, etc.?  I was wondering because the country has
           been having a negative personal savings rate recently.
                \_ disposable income = income minus primary needs (food,
2001/2/13-15 [Recreation/Dating] UID:20585 Activity:high
2/13    I'm dateless, but I'm a super hot shot dude at a cool gaming
        company (not going IPO yet). What should I do?
         \_ are you super hot as well?
        \_ man date
        \_ Get back to work, "hot shot"!
        \_ Dates are overrated. Save your money.
        \_ Back to work, bob.
           \_ Nice try.  Last I heard (fairly recently) bob was dating
              a moderatly hot chick.
              \_ boy, that 'moderately hot chick' is a MAN, BABY!
              \_ you is out of touch
                 \_ nah.  you're just jealous. poor guy -- with valentine's
                    day coming up and all.
              \_ i thought him and geordan were gay?
                 \_ _he_ and geordan.  imbecile.
                    \_ Look, I told you, I'm not gay.  Chicks just hate me.
                       There is a different. -geordan
                       There is a difference. -geordan
                       \_ What makes you think women hate gay guys?
        \_ Valentine's day is a stupid custom invented by a conspiracy of
           greeting-card, flower-shop and chocolate-candy manufacturers.
           Think different!
           \_ Tell this to your next gf as explanation for why she got
              nothing.  You'll go far in life.  You're a genius.  You've got
              it all figured out.  If you ever manage to procreate, try the
              same line with your kids when Dec. 25th rolls around each year.
              They'll love you for keeping them up to date on the latest
              commercialism conspiracies.
           \_ Think "sour grapes"!
           \_ ...Think sodomy!
           \_ If you don't show up at the girlfriend's place with some form
              of gift, you might be thinking "Damn, why'd she dump me?"
           \_ Manager: Okay, people.  We need to cook up a new holiday for the
                       summer.  Something with, eh, gifts, cards, assorted
              Woman:   How about something religious?  We had great penetration
                       last spring with "Christmas II"!
              Man:     Ooh, I know, Spendover, like Passover, but less talk,
                       more presents!
              \_ Love Day!
        \_ yermom
        \_ once again, Watch "Caligula" to fully appreciate valentine's day.
2001/2/13-15 [Computer/HW/Drives] UID:20586 Activity:high
2/13    I'm looking around for a very small PC I can use as a portable
        firewall, fileserver, whatnot, to run FreeBSD on.  I have looked
        at <DEAD><DEAD> and want something of that size, but
        advantechs are a bit pricey.  All I need is a serial port, two
        network cards, space for an IDE laptop drive, approx. a Pentium200,
        and preferably no CPU or power supply fans (noise.)  Can someone give
        me a tip how I can build or buy something like this?  -John
        \_ How about a Toshiba Libretto?
           \_ Dual PCMCIA nics are quite expensive. Better to get one of
              those one board pc's with a plastic case from Radio Shack.
        \_ custom order it from bsdi.
           \_ The 1U box is quite loud and expensive ($1300).
        \_ buy a bookpc
           \_ This thing is pretty damn nice.
              Other alternatives if NetBSD/OpenBSD is okay for you:
              1. A old Sun SparcStation IPX - small, quiet, dual nics are
                 around $35 each. You can't really add an IDE drive but a
                 1 or 2 gig Seagate Hawk or a Quantum Fireball is all you
                 really need for a firewall/dns/dhcp/print server.
                 If you need more processing power and disk isn't important,
                 you might consider a SparcStation 10. There isn't enough
                 room to mount an IDE disk in a SS10, though.
              2. A old Sun SparcStation 2 - reasonably quiet, low power
                 draw, one extra nic is ~ $35. You can get a IDE to SCSI
                 converter and use and IDE disk.
              3. A old Sun SparcStation 4/5/20 - reasonably quiet, low
                 power draw, one extra nic can be had for $35. You can
                 get a IDE to SCSI converter (I have one in my SS20) and
                 use any IDE disk (I'm running a 10 GB seagate). With an
                 IDE disk, these systems are pretty quiet.
              4. A Cobalt Qube2 - small, quite, dual nics built in, any
                 IDE drive will work. Installing NetBSD is a little hard,
                 but once you have it running, it works great.
              All of these (except perhaps a Qube2) can be had for under
              $150, excluding the IDE to SCSI converter ($76).
                \_ why the fuck would you use a Sun box for this application?
                   particularly when Fuzzy specified Intel hardware.  -tom
                   \_ Sun boxes are much quieter than Intel hardware and
                           it stupid.
                      the ones I mentioned are much cheaper as well. Plus
                      you don't have to put up with all that PC stupidity.
                        \_ Just because you don't understand it doesn't make
                           it stupid. Yeah, futzing with jumpers for
                           IRQs and memory base addresses is *really*
                        \_ Sun boxes are absolutely not any quieter than
                           Intel hardware.  What a ridiculous statement.
                           And the ones you mentioned aren't any cheaper
                           than Intel hardware of equivalent age.  -tom
                           \_ How much sun equipment do you own? I have
                              every single one of the boxes that I
                              mentioned and they much quieter than my
                              pentium box and draw considerably less
                              power. A P-200 class machines in the
                              form factor that he wants will cost about
                              $200 to $300. That is not counting dual
                              nics and other peripherals. An IPX or SS2
                              is about $45 + a $35 nic and you have a
                              decent firewall that can handle wirespeed
                              10BaseT filtering for $80. A CPU upgrade
                              puts you at $160 tops. A SS10 will maybe
                              cost $40 more.
                                \_ I run something like 300 Sun boxes.
                                   The fact that *your* pentium box is loud
                                   is completely irrelevant; the noise in
                                   a computer is either the fan or the disk
                                   and there's no reason either should be
                                   louder on a Pentium than a Sparc.  A P-200
                                   class machine is about 4 years newer than
                                   an IPX or Sparc 2, and it would only cost
                                   $300 if you were buying it from marco. -tom
                                   \_ Did you check his link? The form factor
                                      he wants is roughly the same as a IPX.
                                      Find him a PC in that form factor for
                                      under $200.
                                      The reason that PC's are louder is that
                                      they run hotter (CPU fans) and require
                                      much larger power supplies (200 or 250
                                      W compared to a 140 W in the SS10 and
                                      smaller in the IPX) which require much
                                      larger fans. These fans are often of
                                      much lower quality and often rattle
                                      lose bearings.
                                      It is irrelavant that a 200 MHz PC is
                                      4 years newer than a IPX. He wants a
                                      light usage firewarell. A IPX can filter
                                      10BaseT traffic at wirespeed. The
                                      PCI/ISA bus controller on a PC of that
                                      vintage can't handle that the SBus
                                      controller can.
                              \_ An E450 is deafening
                                 \_ I'm not talking about a E450.
2001/2/13-14 [Recreation/Media] UID:20587 Activity:high
2/13    Crouching Tiger, Hidden Dragon nominated for best picture and best
        foreign picture.  Why do I have a feeling that it will get snubbed
        once again on oscar night?  Joining Farewell, My Concubine, the wedding
        banquet, Eat Drink Man, Woman, and a long list of other chinese
        \_ it'll get snubbed because it's not the best picture, any more than
           "Die Hard" would be.
           \_ i second that sentiment.
              \_ CTHD blew. The only thing it was really good for was special
                 effects.  It's only that the American public has never seen
                 real chinese kung fu dramas/movies/series that people here
                 liked it.  The fact that EB is next on this list for best
                 picture really just reflects how poor a year it was for movies.
                 Cast Away might win just from novelty. But then again, CTHD has
                 more novelty for the Academy, so maybe not.
                 \_ I dunno. I've seen plenty of Chinese Martial Arts movies
                    and I thought CTHD was pretty damn good.
                    \_ I especially like the scene where Chow Yun Fat and that
                       woman were swinging on tree tops and fighting.  It's so
                        \_ ya i like it when she stabs that other chump in the
                           cave, he looks at the wound, and then fucks her.
                                \_ well you know, it's well established that
                                   such stabbing is irresistably erotic; c.f.
                                   the Highlander Effect.
                           \_ What movie are you talking about!!?
                              \_ That scene _was_ in CTHD
           \_ But it is better than the piece of junk Gladiator.
                \_ Don't bet on Gladiator.  Bet on Erin Brokovich.
                   \_ I wouldn't mind, but I doubt Erin Brokovish is
                      going to win.
              \_ well gladiator was more exciting and wasn't as cheesy.
                 \_ Gladiator was a total knock off of the "Fall of the
                    Roman Empire".  Exactly the same characters and
                    \_ yes but that's irrelevant.
                 \_ The only exciting part was the fight against the
                    chariot archers.  Not one scene comes close to
                    the fight in Spartacus between Spartacus and the
                    black warrior in terms of realism, unpredictability,
                    desperation and tension.
                 \_ yeah, and Gladiator was much more homoerotic than
                    Crouching Tiger, Hidden Dragon
        \_ Well, if they replaced Chow Yun Fat with Mel Gibson or some
           other white leading man, CTHD would be a lock. -Hoyt
                \_ if it were a white leading man, yi yi wouldn't have
                waited until the end of the movie to bare her wet chest
                to him. in fact, it would have been a fuckfest from the
                start. yah baby!
           \_ Patriot and Braveheart didn't win (as i recall). I thought
              they were great movies.
              Did castaway get nominated (I'm too lazy to check on yahoo)?
              If it did, I'm predicting a 3rd Oscar for Tom Hanks. (I don't
              like him, but I'm not a liberal hollywood type.)
              \_ Braveheart did win best picture
                 \_ Really? Wow. Okay, I guess I was wrong. Patriot didn't
                    win anything did it?
                    \_ Christ, why should it?  It was a pretty lackluster
                       \_ I liked it. I though it was a good movie.
                          But most movies I like don't get nominated for
                    \_ no
        \_ In what language/dialect is the movie filmed?  I watched a
           Cantonese version on (pirated?) DVD but the male voice wasn't Chow
           Yun Fat's.
           \_ mandarin
              \_ cantonese would've been much better.
                 \_ I have this version too.  Its damn annoying to
                   to see CYF and hear some wimpy guy's voice.
        \_ Traffic, Gladiator and Erin Brockavich were all good. Crouch...
           was a surprise but I guess I have to see it first.
2020/07/16 [General] UID:1000 Activity:popular
Berkeley CSUA MOTD:2001:February:13 Tuesday <Monday, Wednesday>